Tesla

[GoCougs]

Not sure what you mean by the plaid strategy as the plaid has 3 motors to the model S long range's 2 motors. Huge hardware difference there.

If you mean the plaid comes with a choice of wheels, the model Y also comes with a choice of wheels as well.  The plaid doesn't have any suspension choices and the carbon brakes are a dealer add on that hasn't materialized yet.

Tesla doesn't sell a software upgrade to bring LR to performance levels for 2 reasons.  One is that for a while there was a motor difference between the cars, just like there was a brake difference, but Tesla has been consistently eliminating those to cut costs.  Second is to maintain demand for the performance.  That difference in acceleration is only evident at lower speeds as repeated test have shown that the performance model will not trap higher than the long range model and boost doesn't change that trap speed either. It would not make sense to have different hardware when the  the cars operate identically much of the time.

Previously for the Model 3 tesla did have a strategy of selling a stealth performance model which didn't have the larger wheels and lowered suspension compared to the PUP version that did at the cost of range.  Acceleration was the same between the two.

At that time Tesla would software upgrade the long range to the stealth performance at the delivery centers if they didn't have enough stock as the long range and stealth performance cars were identical except for software as advertised by Tesla.

Anyway unless you work for Tesla or have some kind of inside information, no tear down or company info have ever found or claimed any difference between the two powertrains besides software and the possibility of a designated performance or long range motor. Tesla is pretty transparent about technical specs of each motor and battery pack it uses around the world.   With the newest batch of production that has switched to hairpin motors, every hairpin motored Tesla Y built for the US has carried the 4D1 motor.

I don't work for Tesla and have zero inside or product info, however, I do know a thing or two about design/manufacturing plus the application of power electronics, esp. electric motors. Three (known) versions of firmware and now all these hidden/secret options and configurations of the vehicle is the exact opposite of streamlining design or manufacturing. That is a ginormous pile of work and cost. I am no fan of Tesla but it's inconceivable to me that they'd be this haphazard with product management if the LR and P vehicles were (now) identical in powertrain and drivetrain hardware. "Maintain demand" does not logically work for me especially given Tesla's pricing approach to the S/X Plaid.

[MrH]

They plan their manufacturing by spreadsheet.  They need to simplify because they can't plan any better.  It's by necessity.

[GoCougs]

They plan their manufacturing by spreadsheet.  They need to simplify because they can't plan any better.  It's by necessity.

No surprise. I'm sure you've seen many many many manufacturers plan (and design/configure/maintain/price/rev,  etc.) using Excel.

That all these hidden/secret options and configurations once existed (to get vehicles out the door given a mishmash of hardware), they've since simplified greatly.

[Morris Minor]

I'm guessing the myriad permutations of the Tahoe/Suburban/Yukon/YukonXL/Escalade/Escalade ESV need a lot more than a spreadsheet. I wonder if anyone's ever counted them.
Sorry we've got to stop production because the the bloke who paints the $200 Chevy bowties black got the 'rona.

[MrH]

No surprise. I'm sure you've seen many many many manufacturers plan (and design/configure/maintain/price/rev,  etc.) using Excel.

That all these hidden/secret options and configurations once existed (to get vehicles out the door given a mishmash of hardware), they've since simplified greatly.

Yes, plenty of places plan with Excel.  And especially things like the product planning, etc.  But I can confidently say I've never seen an OEM assembly plant actually operate using spreadsheets except for Tesla.

I'm guessing the myriad permutations of the Tahoe/Suburban/Yukon/YukonXL/Escalade/Escalade ESV need a lot more than a spreadsheet. I wonder if anyone's ever counted them.
Sorry we've got to stop production because the the bloke who paints the $200 Chevy bowties black got the 'rona.

The Germans are notoriously complicated here.  You can have nearly infinite combination, especially when you see how many options you can individually pick in other markets.  Mercedes C-class, sedan only, had over 200 finished good SKUs for front macpherson strut.  There were hundreds more SKUs when you consider wagon, convertible, coupe, AMG, etc.

[Laconian]

https://electrek.co/2023/04/24/tesla-triesowners-give-up-unlimited-free-supercharging-for-life/

I wonder how much this unlimited charging is costing them in reality. I've heard that SC stations in LA have big backups and wait times.

My brother said that the Leafs with unlimited charging are used really frivolously and clutter up the stalls while topping up to 100%. Unlimited anything makes people behave badly.

[AutobahnSHO]

https://electrek.co/2023/04/24/tesla-triesowners-give-up-unlimited-free-supercharging-for-life/

I wonder how much this unlimited charging is costing them in reality. I've heard that SC stations in LA have big backups and wait times.

My brother said that the Leafs with unlimited charging are used really frivolously and clutter up the stalls while topping up to 100%. Unlimited anything makes people behave badly.

Gas stations are bad enough, I don't want to deal with the public where common sense and some courtesy are practically requisite to make things flow smoothly...

[SJ_GTI]

Hopping back to Tesla's earning, the #2 EV maker in the US (GM) just reported its revenue and profit for Q1. Q1 revenue was almost 40 billion and profit (adjust earnings) was over 3 billion, which was better than expectations. They also increased their profit guidance for the full year 2023.

Now of course the vast majority of their revenue and profit still comes from ICE cars, but their CEO said they are not planning to get into a price war with Tesla. SO far investors haven't believed them and their stock has been hurt each time Tesla reduced prices. But maybe they are right. Maybe there is so much demand right now that even with Tesla cutting prices to keep demand high, everyone else will be able to keep selling every EV they make anyway.

I know from my brother's experience last month when car shopping the pickings were slim. His first choice/instinct was to get a Bolt, but none were available at MSRP anywhere within driving distance. He ended up with a Ford Mach-E at MSRP being the best deal he could find.

[Morris Minor]

Son & daughter-in-law ended with a surplus dishwasher: brand new & unopened in the shipping material. They listed it for sale & a guy from the East Bay told them he'd rent a truck & come & get it.  He showed up in a Model X - haha.  It wouldn't fit through the hatch... I was convinced they'd have to unpack the thing. But they opened up one of the gull wing doors & they slid it through there.

[Laconian]

The Coke bottle is doing a bang up job of simulating an attentive human.

https://twitter.com/DevonGuerrero/status/1651623250773016576

[Morris Minor]

Tesla removed the steering wheel nag in January. Only requirement now is to be there & looking like you're in charge.

[GoCougs]

Jesus. I thought that stuff was axed long ago. That is terrifying (and telling).

[afty]

I don't think they actually removed the steering wheel nag.  Mine certainly still nags me, though I don't have FSD.

[Laconian]

Coke bottle nag.

[Morris Minor]

I like the Coke bottle nag override option. Elon should keep it and add a fifth of whiskey bottle option for more adventurous outcomes.

[AutobahnSHO]

Son & daughter-in-law ended with a surplus dishwasher: brand new & unopened in the shipping material. They listed it for sale & a guy from the East Bay told them he'd rent a truck & come & get it.  He showed up in a Model X - haha.  It wouldn't fit through the hatch... I was convinced they'd have to unpack the thing. But they opened up one of the gull wing doors & they slid it through there.

You can fit clothes washers in the side doors of minivans....

[CaminoRacer]

You can fit clothes washers in the side doors of minivans....

Yep, like a Model X

[Laconian]

https://carnewschina.com/2023/05/12/breaking-tesla-recalls-over-1-1-million-vehicles-in-china-due-to-accelerator-pedal-alert-issue/

I don't understand. Is the problem that Teslas operate in one-pedal mode by default and newbie drivers who learned on their Teslas aren't aware that the brake pedal exists?

[AutobahnSHO]

https://carnewschina.com/2023/05/12/breaking-tesla-recalls-over-1-1-million-vehicles-in-china-due-to-accelerator-pedal-alert-issue/

I don't understand. Is the problem that Teslas operate in one-pedal mode by default and newbie drivers who learned on their Teslas aren't aware that the brake pedal exists?

From the latter part of the article, sounds like the people who THINK they're pushing on the brake but they're mashing on the accelerator.

Car makers could/should figure out a way to make them feel differently under foot?

[MrH]

https://carnewschina.com/2023/05/12/breaking-tesla-recalls-over-1-1-million-vehicles-in-china-due-to-accelerator-pedal-alert-issue/

I don't understand. Is the problem that Teslas operate in one-pedal mode by default and newbie drivers who learned on their Teslas aren't aware that the brake pedal exists?

Tons of claims of sudden, unintended acceleration have been going on with Tesla for years now.  No one really knows what the truth is.  There are videos of Teslas going through walls of buildings though, with the brake lights on the entire time.

[Laconian]

After looking around some more it looks like the culprit is one pedal driving not braking when the battery is full. I guess Teslas don't have the brakes wired in to the one pedal function?

China M3s use LFP chemistry and are recommended to be charged to 100%, which would be bad for one-pedallers.

[MrH]

After looking around some more it looks like the culprit is one pedal driving not braking when the battery is full. I guess Teslas don't have the brakes wired in to the one pedal function?

China M3s use LFP chemistry and are recommended to be charged to 100%, which would be bad for one-pedallers.

Bolt is the same way.  That's not it.  The general claim is the car rocketing forward during parking maneuvers.  Again, zero idea if that's true or not, but anecdotally, there are a ton of tesla's driving through walls.

[Morris Minor]

Not even sure it was Tesla-specific but I vaguely remember seeing something about trip planning tools that took terrain into account .. e.g. from a brake regen angle, it's better to arrive at the top of a mountain pass with half a battery charge than with a pack say 3/4 full.

But yes I can see how your brake pedal instincts could atrophy if you're a dedicated one pedal driver.

[r0tor]

I've never thought about it, but how do you park with one foot driving?  Normally you just ride the brakes to regulate speed/position

[Laconian]

The responses get remapped at very low speed so that it will come to a complete stop if the pedal isn't applied.

I don't like it, personally. And it's less efficient on my car since it engages the front motor full time.

[MrH]

Parking is really herky jerky in the Bolt compared to normal driving mode.  I've gotten a lot better, but it's still not nearly as smooth.  I like one-pedal though now that I'm used to it.

[Laconian]

The EV6 and Ioniq 5 have an automatic regen system that is more efficient than the i-pedal (one pedal) mode. It uses nav data (probably the speed limit) and some radar data to dynamically adjust the level of regeneration. It's a bit like the car gently downshifting in anticipation of a gentle stop. I downshift when I coast to a stop in my cars so it feels very natural to me.

[Laconian]

The brakes were never applied.

[AutobahnSHO]

Interesting.

I learned the other day as I'm hunting for fuse panel to wire dashcames in Maverick that the gas pedal is completely drive-by-wire, no accelerator cable coming out of it, just a bunch of wires.

And it parks ultra smooth, it's programmed to creep forward like an auto transmission car when foot is not on the brake.

[giant_mtb]

Interesting.

I learned the other day as I'm hunting for fuse panel to wire dashcames in Maverick that the gas pedal is completely drive-by-wire, no accelerator cable coming out of it, just a bunch of wires.

And it parks ultra smooth, it's programmed to creep forward like an auto transmission car when foot is not on the brake.

Pretty much all new vehicles are drive-by-wire on the gas pedal, and also the shifter/transmission. No actual mechanical connection...you could probably shift to Reverse at highway speed and nothing would happen besides it ceasing to accelerate/drive forward until you put it back in Drive because it has built-in safeguards for just such things since it's just an electronic connection monitored by computers.