991.2 GT3 Touring Package: Manual only with an understated appearance

[12,000 RPM]

Interesting

So if these:





Are the same as the 911 GT3, why does Porsche make a completely different car for Group GT3, and why are Group GT3 cars not road legal?

[r0tor]

Are you seriously trying to argue a GT3 911 is designed to be a grand touring car and not a track model closely related as possible to their GT3 race cars?

Holy hell...

[12,000 RPM]

No, I'm saying "GT cars" are made for the road. 911 GT3 is too, which is why they federalize it and load it with emissions and safety stuff

[68_427]

Um the GT3 is a street car first and foremost.

"In addition to Porsche Communication Management (PCM) including an online navigation module with real-time traffic information, the standard equipment of every 911 GT3"


Also "GT3" racing didn't exist until 2005.  The 996 GT3 was introduced in 1999 and raced in FIA N-GT

[Raza]

Lotus Evora?  There was one at the local AutoX last weekend (fitted with a supercharger).  Goodness, that was a sexy car.

Evora is way down the scale, though. The original Evoras are cheap now, if you wanted one. But even the current 400 or whatever it's called doesn't really compete with the base 911.

[Raza]

The GT3 is of course a street GT car, especially this model and non-RS models.

[12,000 RPM]

If this touring edition has a back seat that seals the deal for me.

[68_427]

If this touring edition has a back seat that seals the deal for me.

It doesn't.  No word on it being optional, but I'm sure for a certain sum of money Porsche will put them back in.  (There was at least 1 997 GT3 sold with rear seats)

[r0tor]

OK, what exactly makes a GT3 a "grand touring car"  and not a track oriented car?  The lack of sound insulation? The stiff as hell suspension? The optional roll cage? Perhaps it's the Pilot Cup 2 tires?

[12,000 RPM]

OK, what exactly makes a GT3 a "grand touring car"  and not a track oriented car?  The lack of sound insulation? The stiff as hell suspension? The optional roll cage? Perhaps it's the Pilot Cup 2 tires?

You are all over the place. The only thing I am disputing is this statement:

It's a GT car..  which are made for the track

This is just not true.

And yea, while the GT3 is equipped for track duty, it is still a road car first.

[r0tor]

You are all over the place. The only thing I am disputing is this statement:
This is just not true.

And yea, while the GT3 is equipped for track duty, it is still a road car first.

GT = gran turismo alla long distance ROAD cruiser. Man you really just don't give a fuck what official definitions are huh

Thanks for playing

[12,000 RPM]

?

Yes, that is the definition of a "GT car"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_tourer
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/gt-car



Do you play to lose?

[r0tor]

A GT3 is a miserable  example of a "Grand Touring"  car... Great example of a track focused car though

[Cookie Monster]

This is still a stupid argument. Would you track any of those $250k cars regularly? Even if you did, are you a good enough driver to realize the gains from a carbon monocoque tub? By your logic, every one of those cars in the GT3's class is a track car, so they'll all be equally shitty for the street. Why not get the one you actually enjoy driving and like the most on the street and the track?

If that's the McLaren for you, good for you, but I don't think it's dumb to think someone would buy a GT3 over a McLaren. If that were the case, no one would buy any of the higher end 911s.

[12,000 RPM]

Yea the 911R sold out immediately and is trading hands for as much as McLaren and Ferrari supercars. I think the GT3 is definitely in that discussion.

Me personally, if I could afford a car like this I would track it regularly. Where can you deploy 500+ HP with any regularity in US roads? It's such a different driving experience. But I feel like with the stick the GT3 would also be the most fun puttering around town.

[r0tor]

This is still a stupid argument. Would you track any of those $250k cars regularly? Even if you did, are you a good enough driver to realize the gains from a carbon monocoque tub? By your logic, every one of those cars in the GT3's class is a track car, so they'll all be equally shitty for the street. Why not get the one you actually enjoy driving and like the most on the street and the track?

If that's the McLaren for you, good for you, but I don't think it's dumb to think someone would buy a GT3 over a McLaren. If that were the case, no one would buy any of the higher end 911s.

Personally, if I could afford a $250k+ car I would also have a membership at the Monticello Motorsports club and attend as much as possible.

[Cookie Monster]

Personally, if I could afford a $250k+ car I would also have a membership at the Monticello Motorsports club and attend as much as possible.

OK, still doesn't answer the question - are you a good enough driver to take advantage of all the benefits of a carbon tub? Are you willing to give up some driver engagement on both the street and track for some tenths of a second during a track day that you're not competing in and doing just for fun?

[r0tor]

The 650S is a better car in pretty much every measure

... I'm also not exactly lacking in driving talent...

[Cookie Monster]

The 650S is a better car in pretty much every measure

... I'm also not exactly lacking in driving talent...

So you can wring out a 500hp car to its exact limits so well that you need a 641hp car for track duty?

It's especially silly when track days are about fun and driver education rather than outright lap times or racing.

[12,000 RPM]

Right... someone with driving talent won't need the extra HP

Also the 650S starts well above $250K. r0tor's favorite sport is running around with goalposts.

[r0tor]

So you can wring out a 500hp car to its exact limits so well that you need a 641hp car for track duty?

It's especially silly when track days are about fun and driver education rather than outright lap times or racing.

Oh , please tell me about my driving abilities 

[r0tor]

Right... someone with driving talent won't need the extra HP

Also the 650S starts well above $250K. r0tor's favorite sport is running around with goalposts.

http://www.dupontregistry.com/autos/results/porsche/911--gt3--rs

https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/l-Used-McLaren-650S-d2300


... Same goal posts...

[MrH]

Now you're comparing used prices?

[MexicoCityM3]

The GT3 is a fantastic car that is undisputed by me. But all of you guys calling it a GT road car primarily are bonkers.

GT = Grand Touring

The GT3 may be street legal but it definitely is a track day special first and foremost. It CAN be used on the street. It CAN be a daily if you live ina place with excellent roads and no crime. But it was designed to be a track monster. The suspension is very stiff, it makes a lot of (good) noise and it is not confortable for long trips or especially for sitting in heavy traffic shifting that much loved manual.

Great GT cars: Aston Martins (most of them), The big V12 Ferraris, M6, Bentley Continental, 911 Turbo, etc. NOT THE EFFING GT3.

[MX793]

Conflating the FIA's "GT" racing classification with the actual meaning of the term

[r0tor]

Now you're comparing used prices?

Try getting a new one

[Rich]

r0tor's favorite sport is running around with goalposts.

😂😂😂😂😂

[r0tor]

Conflating the FIA's "GT" racing classification with the actual meaning of the term

Just where do you think Porsche came up with the "GT3" nameplate?  "GT" doesn't stand for "Grand Touring"  in Porscheland.

[Cookie Monster]

Oh , please tell me about my driving abilities 

You're the one who brought up the fact that you're a professional driver.


For me, I'll gladly take the "hit" on track performance on a car I know I can't fully exploit for more fun on the street.

I don't understand your argument. On one hand, the GT3 isn't as good on the track as a McLaren, but on the other hand, it's too much track car for the street. Which one is it?

[r0tor]

A 650s is better on the street and track and in a straight line... Chris harris did this already