"12 stroke", 2 stroke on demand, HCCI, etc. - the Digital Engine

Started by Laconian, August 12, 2018, 05:41:14 PM

Laconian

Kia EV6 GT-Line / MX-5 RF 6MT

CaminoRacer

2020 BMW 330i, 1969 El Camino, 2017 Bolt EV

12,000 RPM

Lots of ways to slice it. I'm still bullish on electrification. Expensive, but relatively simple and reliable. Will be cool if they actually implement this though.

I'm also very intrigued by the opposed piston 2 strokes....
Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs

Galaxy

Quote from: CaminoRacer on August 12, 2018, 06:29:39 PM
Guess they haven't heard of FreeValve.

They updated the article at the end because of FreeValve.

CaminoRacer

Quote from: Galaxy on August 12, 2018, 11:00:42 PM
They updated the article at the end because of FreeValve.

Ah, I see.

I suppose this new system does allow more freedom, since you can install a very high lift, high duration cam and then only go part of the way up for low-rpm cruising, then return back down the lobe instead of cresting it.
2020 BMW 330i, 1969 El Camino, 2017 Bolt EV

Laconian

I thought MultiAir engines could deliver some of these great things, but aren't those engines all turds?
Kia EV6 GT-Line / MX-5 RF 6MT


Galaxy

Quote from: Laconian on August 12, 2018, 11:15:28 PM
I thought MultiAir engines could deliver some of these great things, but aren't those engines all turds?

I wondered about that as well. I guess deficiencies in other areas of the engine counteract the advanced engine control potential of multiair. Plus Multiair is a hydraulic system, that adds a lot of problems.


MX793

Quote from: Laconian on August 12, 2018, 11:15:28 PM
I thought MultiAir engines could deliver some of these great things, but aren't those engines all turds?

Fancy heads on 25-30 year old engine designs (FIRES engine that Fiat uses came out in 1985).  Plus, the Italians don't have a great reputation for robust, complicated designs.
Needs more Jiggawatts

2016 Ford Mustang GTPP / 2011 Toyota Rav4 Base AWD / 2014 Kawasaki Ninja 1000 ABS
1992 Nissan 240SX Fastback / 2004 Mazda Mazda3s / 2011 Ford Mustang V6 Premium / 2007 Suzuki GSF1250SA Bandit / 2006 VW Jetta 2.5

12,000 RPM

I love N/A engines but as far as efficiency goes I'm feeling like the biggest ROIs are in recapturing waste energy.... be it from the exhaust or the brakes. Character is always going to come at the expense of efficiency.... if these heads allow high revving, the rest of the engine will have to be designed around that and be less efficient overall. And I think people who prioritize engine character *generally* don't care about fuel economy.

So for my money I'd rather have the investments and focus be made in recapturing waste heat. Out of the losses pie that's where the bulk of the pain is. Plus there are huge gains to be made just in overall engine design. Look at Toyota's new 2.0L:

https://newsroom.toyota.co.jp/en/powertrain2018/engine/

It's a regular old NA engine. But through a holistic focus on efficiency and simplicity they've achieved record high thermal efficiencies in engines going into ~$20K cars. Imagine that focus integrated with an electric turbo and regenerative braking. All of a sudden fancy valvetrains become a bit expensive. Which is why I think automakers have pulled away from them.
Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs

r0tor

Quote from: Laconian on August 12, 2018, 11:15:28 PM
I thought MultiAir engines could deliver some of these great things, but aren't those engines all turds?

The multiair 2 in the alfa giulia/stelvio is pretty stout... Capable of ~350hp and 35 mpg with a tune
2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee No Speed -- 2004 Mazda RX8 6 speed -- 2018 Alfa Romeo Giulia All Speed

MrH

Quote from: Laconian on August 12, 2018, 11:15:28 PM
I thought MultiAir engines could deliver some of these great things, but aren't those engines all turds?

Yes.  Yes they are.
2023 Ford Lightning Lariat ER
2019 Acura RDX SH-AWD
2023 BRZ Limited

Previous: '02 Mazda Protege5, '08 Mazda Miata, '05 Toyota Tacoma, '09 Honda Element, '13 Subaru BRZ, '14 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec 5.0, '15 Toyota 4Runner SR5, '18 Honda Accord EX-L 2.0t, '01 Honda S2000, '20 Subaru Outback XT, '23 Chevy Bolt EUV

GoCougs

Quote from: CaminoRacer on August 12, 2018, 06:29:39 PM
Guess they haven't heard of FreeValve.

FreeValve uses air and the like; this is purely electromechanical.

FoMoJo

Quote from: CaminoRacer on August 12, 2018, 06:29:39 PM
Guess they haven't heard of FreeValve.
Does Koenigsegg's system have the ability to limit the opening of the valves?  Haven't kept up with it lately.
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once." ~ Albert Einstein
"As the saying goes, when you mix science and politics, you get politics."

12,000 RPM

Protecctor of the Atmospheric Engine #TheyLiedToUs