EVs

[Galaxy]

Considering how much power it has, I'm not surprised.

The Tesla does not have less performance though, at least short term. It is embarrassing for the rest of the car industry that they can not match Tesla for total efficiency of the electric drive train.

[CaminoRacer]

The Tesla does not have less performance though, at least short term. It is embarrassing for the rest of the car industry that they can not match Tesla for total efficiency of the electric drive train.

See my edit.

Plus it sounds like Porsche's efforts were on making an electric sports sedan that drives just as well, if not better, than an ICE sports sedan. Not aimed at techies or greenies as much as Tesla. And it seems like they've accomplished that.

[afty]

Considering how much power it has, I'm not surprised. Also sounds like it doesn't take advantage of regen. I know it doesn't do 1 pedal driving but I'm not sure if the brake pedal activates regen before the hydraulic brakes like other EVs do.

Power is mostly orthogonal to efficiency in EVs, that's one of the great things about them. You can have your cake and eat it too.

The Taycan does use regen when you apply the brakes. Porsche claims 90% of an average driver's braking is done by regen and not the friction brakes.

[shp4man]

Regen programming uses sensors on the brake pedal to determine how to balance regen and the hydraulic braking system. They all activate the hydraulic system in the last 5MPH of a braking event. The actual brake pressure is generated by the ABS pump. There is a manual backup system, but it's mostly a "fly by wire" system.

[MrH]

Porsche does actual validation testing on their cars, so it's really apples to oranges

[Galaxy]

Regen programming uses sensors on the brake pedal to determine how to balance regen and the hydraulic braking system. They all activate the hydraulic system in the last 5MPH of a braking event. The actual brake pressure is generated by the ABS pump. There is a manual backup system, but it's mostly a "fly by wire" system.

Most regen systems are one pedal though, the car starts regenerating once you lift off the "gas."

[shp4man]

Most regen systems are one pedal though, the car starts regenerating once you lift off the "gas."

True.

[FoMoJo]

Most regen systems are one pedal though, the car starts regenerating once you lift off the "gas."

Doesn't that slow you down rather abruptly?

[afty]

Doesn't that slow you down rather abruptly?

To me it feels a lot like engine braking when you're driving a manual.

[NomisR]

To me it feels a lot like engine braking when you're driving a manual.

Yeah, kinda like driving in 2nd gear most of the time. 

[Laconian]

Yeah, kinda like driving in 2nd gear most of the time. 

That's a pretty good description of it.

[AutobahnSHO]

Gross. I'd rather be in 3rd or 4th....

[NomisR]

Gross. I'd rather be in 3rd or 4th....

It's not really that bad, the braking is stronger that I'd like but you get used to it. 

[Galaxy]

Some cars allow you to set the amount of regen braking.

[afty]

Some cars allow you to set the amount of regen braking.

Yup.  Here's the settings menu from my Model 3:



EVs secretly drive a lot like manuals:
1) Regen feels like engine braking
2) Instant throttle response vs. "slushiness" of an automatic
3) Doesn't creep forward when you let off the brake

[giant_mtb]

Regen programming uses sensors on the brake pedal to determine how to balance regen and the hydraulic braking system. They all activate the hydraulic system in the last 5MPH of a braking event. The actual brake pressure is generated by the ABS pump. There is a manual backup system, but it's mostly a "fly by wire" system.

...what.

[CaminoRacer]

It's not really that bad, the braking is stronger that I'd like but you get used to it. 

And you learn how to modulate the pedal. If you don't want the full "engine braking" regen, don't let off the pedal all the way. It's very easy to modulate and get exactly the amount of acceleration or braking that you want. It's not an on-off switch.

3) Doesn't creep forward when you let off the brake

Chevy's shifters have a D and an "L" mode on the shifter. D drives like a regular car with minimal regen and it'll creep at a stop light when you get off the brake. L is one-pedal driving with lots of regen and no creeping.

I typically drive in L around town and D on the highway (especially if I'm using cruise control)

[MX793]

Oooouch... Porsche Taycan only got certified by the EPA for a 200 mile range

https://jalopnik.com/heres-why-the-porsche-taycan-turbos-epa-range-is-so-bad-1840444842/amp

[2o6]

...what.

?

[Morris Minor]

Harry Metcalfe on living with an EV (Jaguar I-Pace). I'm taking on board here that if you're not in a Tesla (he gets to this at the end) you're effectively tethered to your home charger (at least in the UK, where the pubic charging options are hopeless.) Anyway, this is quite intelligent: recommended.

https://youtu.be/CEyfCcAbtKU

[AutobahnSHO]

There's a single charger at a Barnes & Noble near here.

I think if the big automakers banded together and built out a brand-agnostic network of chargers (or other business did) it would push the market considerably.

[CaminoRacer]

There already are. Plugshare is an app that shows all of the public chargers across the country. And there are networks like Chargepoint, EVGO, and Electrify America that all have apps and stuff. And usually if you have an account with one, you can use it for other networks too (Chargepoint and EVGO cards work with each other for example)
https://www.plugshare.com/

Pretty much all non-Teslas use J1772 plugs. And for quick charging, they use a variant of the J1772 with a DC fast charge addition (50-1000 V, 400 A and 400 kw limit).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAE_J1772

[afty]

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison-test/a30799498/2020-porsche-taycan-turbo-s-vs-2020-tesla-model-s-performance/

Taycan is impressive but just too expensive. Range appears much better than rated. I wonder why it did so poorly in the EPA test?

[cawimmer430]

Yup.  Here's the settings menu from my Model 3:



EVs secretly drive a lot like manuals:
1) Regen feels like engine braking
2) Instant throttle response vs. "slushiness" of an automatic
3) Doesn't creep forward when you let off the brake

What have we learned from this? Your name is Eddie.

[GoCougs]

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/comparison-test/a30799498/2020-porsche-taycan-turbo-s-vs-2020-tesla-model-s-performance/

Taycan is impressive but just too expensive. Range appears much better than rated. I wonder why it did so poorly in the EPA test?

The Taycan does not have one pedal driving AFAIK, and if the EPA loops has of lots of micro regenerations, that would probably do it.

Real-world Taycan Turbo S is getting ~280 miles, which seems to be not much less than real-world Model S Performance w/the big wheels.

[Morris Minor]

Energy density...
EVs work for those who have money and two-car garages, one bay for the ICE vehicle, and one for the fast charger plus EV for grocery getter-length journeys. I still want one... because of my irrational love for cool gadgety toys. 

https://youtu.be/Hatav_Rdnno

[Laconian]

https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/The-US-Coal-Industry-Is-Declining-Irreversibly.html

Coal's share in the US energy mix is going down, fast.

[CaminoRacer]

I drove my Bolt to Moab. If I drove gently I think it could make it the whole way, but there's free quick chargers halfway that we stopped at during our lunch break. And then there's a free quick charger here in Moab.

[AutobahnSHO]

I drove my Bolt to Moab. If I drove gently I think it could make it the whole way, but there's free quick chargers halfway that we stopped at during our lunch break. And then there's a free quick charger here in Moab.

There's a Tesla charger at a hotel in Evanston but I didn't see any other chargers last time we were there.

[CaminoRacer]

There's a Tesla charger at a hotel in Evanston but I didn't see any other chargers last time we were there.

Wyoming looks pretty sparse on the public charger map. Especially compared to Utah and Colorado next door