Toyota Tundra:

[Atomic]

how do you (yes. YOU!) think the all new toyota tundra will impact the every popular pick-up truck market here in the good 'ol u.s.a. here in the united states there are countless ford, gm, and dodge loyalists that are hardcore repeat buyers. the following is an article e-mailed to me at 6:30 a.m., 02/27/06. PLEASE read and respond!

thank you   !

~ atomic

Tundra Obstacle: Big 3 Loyalty

By: Mark Rechtin

From: Automotive News, February 27, 2006 - 6:00 am


LOS ANGELES -- Traditionally cautious Toyota is taking a gamble on the redesigned 2007 Tundra.

Toyota's new assembly plant in San Antonio will double Tundra production, so the automaker must find lots more buyers for its full-sized pickup.

The problem:

The current Tundra is not luring large numbers of Big 3 truck loyalists out of their pickups.

Toyota has been surprised by its inability to win over consumers who already own import-brand cars, says Ernest Bastien, vice president of Toyota's vehicle operations group. In 2005, Toyota sold Tundras to just 8.4 percent of full-sized pickup buyers who already had an import-brand vehicle in their garage, he says.

Toyota also has come up short in attracting first-time buyers of full-sized pickups. "That's where we've missed our greatest opportunities for growth," Bastien says.

Yet Toyota executives are confident they can add 150,000 Tundra buyers a year.

The redesigned truck is due in early 2007. With a 5.7-liter engine, towing capacity of 10,000 pounds and a slew of new model variants, they say the redesigned Tundra should overcome the shortcomings that have hampered its predecessors.

Few domestic trades:

Toyota sold 126,529 Tundras last year, a record for the truck. But a surprisingly small number of those buyers were conquested from the Big 3.

Of those who bought a Tundra, just 8 percent traded in a Ford F-150, and fewer than 6 percent left a Chevrolet Silverado, according to Toyota data. By contrast, 30 percent of Tundra purchasers traded in another Tundra or a compact Tacoma pickup. Many more customers were import-brand loyalists who would not buy a big truck unless Toyota made it.

"We've had some success in appealing to traditional domestic owners," says Bastien. "But it has been limited because body and engine configurations were expanding faster than we were able to introduce them."

In the case of the popular four-door configuration, Toyota was late to the party and missed a big opportunity to lure domestic truck owners when it finally arrived in late 2003.

Toyota found that more than half the customers who rejected the Tundra said it did not offer the configuration they needed or that the dealer did not have the right model in inventory.

Another major reason for rejection was the Tundra's low towing capacity. The new model, with more configurations and higher towing capacity, will address both those concerns, Bastien says.

Toyota also loses some rural customers because it lacks a nearby dealership. Toyota has about 1,200 dealerships, compared with 3,800 for Ford, 4,100 for Chevrolet and 2,900 for Dodge. Toyota is adding rural satellite dealerships to appeal to farmers and ranchers. But that plan is expected to add a couple of dozen stores at most.

Then there's the matter of overcoming generations of brand loyalty to Ford, Chevrolet and Dodge, observes Leonard Northcutt, who owns Toyota and GM dealerships in Enid, Okla.

"There is a large cultural difference between Toyota and GM customers," Northcutt says. His Tundra sales are predominantly to Toyota loyalists.

Toyota builds the Tundra in Indiana and Texas. But, Northcutt says, "Buy American" sympathies are less important than product attributes.

More than half of domestic truck buyers looked only at replacing their existing truck with the same nameplate, according to the 2005 New Vehicle Customer Study by automotive consulting firm Maritz Research. About 78 percent disposed of a domestic vehicle when buying a domestic-brand full-sized truck.

On the other hand, Toyota is encouraged by Tundra owners' loyalty. Since the launch of the four-dour Double Cab, 43 percent of Tundra buyers were Tundra owners. For a vehicle with a short sales history, Tundra is competitive with the Ford F-150 at 54 percent loyalty and Chevrolet Silverado at 46 percent, according to Toyota data.

The numbers game:

John Wolkonowicz, senior market analyst with Global Insight in Lexington, Mass., doesn't think the new Tundra will win over Big 3 loyalists. He sees the Tundra expanding the overall full-sized truck market, rather than securing a larger piece of the same-sized pie.

Wolkonowicz says shoppers born between 1978 and 1989 love pickups, and there are plenty of white-collar folks with horse trailers and boats who have been waiting for a larger Tundra to arrive. "There is no reason for that truck not to be a success. But customers are going to come from different places than (Toyota) might expect," Wolkonowicz adds.

The huge market for pickups is working in Toyota's favor, says Jim Hossack, an analyst with AutoPacific in Tustin, Calif. "The full-sized half-ton truck universe is 2 million pieces (per year), so Toyota going from 100,000 to 250,000 units is doable," Hossack notes.

"Big 3 truck owners have had a lot of problems, whether it's with GM's engines and transmissions, Ford's Triton with the spark plugs that pop out, or general disenchantment with Dodge quality," says Hossack, who owns two GMC pickups with recurring glitches.

"The Big 3 have given Toyota an opening with their less-than-ideal quality."

Note: Bradford Wernle contributed to this report.

[Atomic]

catman? our spin toyota man! your thoughts, dude?! all others???

[Tom]

Admittedly I didn't read the article but I have a few thoughts on the Tundra that pertain to your question.  

It is now a full-sized, full-powered truck that can compete with the big three.  I doubt it will sell significantly better(atleast at first) than the previous gen, mostly due to brand loyalty(both among private customers, private business, and public govs), the premium price, and it not necessarily being better.

However, I think it will be well recieved by younger buyers, who have not yet formed loyalties, as well as current imort owners.  It will be a good investment for Toyota mainly due to younger buyers who will see it as an equal competitor to the Big 3, the same poeple who will continue to buy cars and trucks for years to come.  

[ifcar]

"However, I think it will be well recieved by younger buyers, who have not yet formed loyalties, as well as current imort owners. It will be a good investment for Toyota mainly due to younger buyers who will see it as an equal competitor to the Big 3, the same poeple who will continue to buy cars and trucks for years to come."

I disagree. People who have grown up around a certain truck and around people loyal to that vehicle, and may even get one as a hand-me-down first car are also very likely to stick with it. Look at footoflead as a prime example, or stop by the GMI forum and see the teenagers talking about their parents' GMs.

It's the people who have either had problems with or have gotten tired of the vehicles they've bought numerous times over the years who will be more willing to try something new.

And there aren't going to be huge numbers of those people no matter what Toyota puts out. The specs are right, which will definitely bring out more. But they're still going to be a fringe player.

[Tom]

"However, I think it will be well recieved by younger buyers, who have not yet formed loyalties, as well as current imort owners. It will be a good investment for Toyota mainly due to younger buyers who will see it as an equal competitor to the Big 3, the same poeple who will continue to buy cars and trucks for years to come."

I disagree. People who have grown up around a certain truck and around people loyal to that vehicle, and may even get one as a hand-me-down first car are also very likely to stick with it. Look at footoflead as a prime example, or stop by the GMI forum and see the teenagers talking about their parents' GMs.

It's the people who have either had problems with or have gotten tired of the vehicles they've bought numerous times over the years who will be more willing to try something new.

And there aren't going to be huge numbers of those people no matter what Toyota puts out. The specs are right, which will definitely bring out more. But they're still going to be a fringe player.

I'm sure there will continue to be a fan following by young Americans.  There are many young poeple who do not have such an influence though.  The time will come for them to own businesses and/or need a truck for personal truck duties.  They will be more likely to make the rational choice.  Furthermore, by this time the Tundra will have existed for longer and will have gained more familiarity and acceptance.  I suggest it will be a gradual change.  Toyota will cut into the full-size market more and more.

[ifcar]

I don't doubt that when it's been around longer, it will sell better.  

[Atomic]

good points, men! i've never owned a pick-up truck. i consider myself to be young, trendy, and quality oriented. i NEVER thought i'd ever consider a truck until the debut of the nissan titan. now there's the toyota tundra. these vehicles, along w/ the honda ridgeline excite me, while fmc, dc motors, and gm trucks do not. why? i'm not certain. at least i'm honest, eh   ???!!!

[Tom]

good points, men! i've never owned a pick-up truck. i consider myself to be young, trendy, and quality oriented. i NEVER thought i'd ever consider a truck until the debut of the nissan titan. now there's the toyota tundra. these vehicles, along w/ the honda ridgeline excite me, while fmc, dc motors, and gm trucks do not. why? i'm not certain. at least i'm honest, eh   ???!!!

So ifcar, for every footoflead there is an atomic.  

Sure, atomic may not want to buy a pickup, but most people who end up buying them don't buy them for for fun.

[ifcar]

I was under the impression that our discussion pertained principally to conquest buyers. footoflead is already a Chevrolet pickup fan from a Chevrolet pickup family; Atomic, as far as I know, is not.

[Catman]

I don't think Toyota will ever dominate this market only because Detroit has retreated to the inner wall of the castle and the fortifications are strong.  However, Toyota will sell more of these new Tundra's and will take some sales from the big three.  While it may not be huge numbers taken from Ford, GM and Dodge it will certainly hurt a bit when those companies are not doing particularly well right now.  I would look for the new Tundra sales to increase to perhaps 50%+ over the current numbers.  The engine options, cab/bed configurations and overall better performance will certainly attract more buyers.

[Atomic]

I was under the impression that our discussion pertained principally to conquest buyers. footoflead is already a Chevrolet pickup fan from a Chevrolet pickup family; Atomic, as far as I know, is not.

oh no! i didn't mean to focus on conquest buyers only! i'm very intrigued by brand loyalty and will be in awe to learn how toyota will lure new buyers to their brand  :P ! pick-up buyers must be the most loyal, eh?!  

[Tom]

I was under the impression that our discussion pertained principally to conquest buyers. footoflead is already a Chevrolet pickup fan from a Chevrolet pickup family; Atomic, as far as I know, is not.

:blink:

The way I took it was you disagreed with my notion that younger buyers will be more open-minded towards pickup trucks.

[ifcar]

I was talking to Tom, sorry.  

[TBR]

Domestic truck buyers are incredibily brand loyal, but they aren't "origin loyal" if that makes any sense. For example, my father is actually MORE likely to buy a Nissan or Toyota truck than a Chevrolet one. I am not saying that makes sense, but it is something to consider. But, what I am saying is that Nissan/Toyota truck sales are more likely to go up than GM, Ford, or Dodge trucks regardless of the actual products.

[SVT666]

The new Tundra will impact Nissan more then the Big 3.  It will take some sales away from the Big3, but it will be extremely difficult to know how much it will impact them considering the Big 3 and Nissan's sales are dropping already due to gas prices.

[Raza]

I'm under the impression that most pickup buyers are "I buy what my daddy bought".

[TBR]

Sometimes, sometimes not. I know people that have been bit by their father's choice and will no longer buy them, while I know others who are too blindly biased to even look at something other than a Ford, Chevy, or Dodge (my brother is like that).

[Car Zeus]

I grew up with Chevy and GMC trucks. My grandfather had them and his father before him.


My dad loved his GMC/Chevy trucks but the last straw came when his transmission gave out for the second time in 4 years. My dad eventually bought the no frills T-100  extended cab and from then on has progressed into Toyota cars.


I also have had a 2004 BMW 745LI, 1999 Toyota TRD Solara, and a 2004 Denali. Out of all these vehicle the Toyota was the one I had no problems with.



Loyalty does come at a price. You stick with something long enough you are bound to get complacent.

[Colonel Cadillac]

My only problem is that I am having a hard time believing it is actually any better than the Ford or Chevy (I have a general idea how the Chevy will act considering the Tahoe reviews).  

[JYODER240]

Coming from a small town, I've always been around the Ford vs. Chevy trucks guys. They are extremely loyal and wouldnt dare drive the other truck. These are the same rednecks that watch NASCAR every weekend and drive the brand of their favorite driver. Its really pathetic to see them.  

[Car Zeus]

LOL

It was a culture shock coming from California and seeing all the Georgia rednecks that act like NASCAR is god.

[thewizard16]

LOL

It was a culture shock coming from California and seeing all the Georgia rednecks that act like NASCAR is god.

I really hate that "sport".    

[sparkplug]

LOL

It was a culture shock coming from California and seeing all the Georgia rednecks that act like NASCAR is god.

I really hate that "sport".  

Too bad. You're loss. You missed out on some good shine.

[thewizard16]

LOL

It was a culture shock coming from California and seeing all the Georgia rednecks that act like NASCAR is god.

I really hate that "sport".  

Too bad. You're loss. You missed out on some good shine.

Now see, all I know is that it's alcohol. I don't know what it's made of, and I'm sure it's not something I'd drink. (Just by reputation/association alone.)

[sparkplug]

LOL

It was a culture shock coming from California and seeing all the Georgia rednecks that act like NASCAR is god.

I really hate that "sport".  

Too bad. You're loss. You missed out on some good shine.

Now see, all I know is that it's alcohol. I don't know what it's made of, and I'm sure it's not something I'd drink. (Just by reputation/association alone.)

You do have be careful. Some people would make shine with galvenized tub and if you had an ulcer it would kill because it would go to the blood.

Basically what happened with Nascar is these moonshine runners thought their car was faster than the other so they started racing other and that's how NASCAR came about. Think about this: they used to call the one hour test session on Saturday, Happy Hour.

[Raza]

Uncle Jessie's recipe is the best.  But he won't make anymore.  He made a promise.