Saab 9-3 Sport Wagon Aero

[BMWDave]

Saab 9-3 Sport Wagon Aero  

Link with Pictures
Given that Saab has not launched any new cars in the UK for nearly two years, you could becould be forgiven for thinking the Swedish firm might be going the same way as MG Rover. However, sales are actually up 40 per cent in 2005, and Saab hopes the new 9-3 Sport Wagon will enhance its appeal further.

While the saloon has been on sale since 2002, the estate adds practicality to the line-up. As with the four-door, the new load-lugger is based on the Epsilon platform that also underpins Vauxhall's Vectra.

Ahead of the C-pillar, the Sport Wagon is identical to the booted car, yet follows the recent estate trend of having a rounded rump. The frosted lights are sharp, and there is plenty of chrome detailing. Although there is a definite hint of America about the rear end - no doubt courtesy of parent firm GM - overall the newcomer is attractive.

Lift the tailgate and there is a practical boot with a flat floor and clever parcel shelf. This is not only removable, but also slides out of the way. Plenty of luggage hooks are fitted, as is a 12V power supply. Unfortunately, the seats cannot be folded totally flat as the bases do not flip up, but it is easy to lower the seatbacks because you only need to pull on a single lever. Even with five people on board, the Saab has a 419-litre load capacity - not enough to match Audi's A4 Avant, but plenty for most buyers.

Up front, the dash is from the 9-3 saloon, with an ergonomic layout only spoiled by some sharp-edged plastics. What is not so impressive is the chassis. The V6 delivers 250bhp and 350Nm of torque to the front tyres, and the car suffers severe torque steer. Over bumpy surfaces, the wheel pulls and squirms in your hands, and this gets worse under hard acceleration. The suspension also struggles to cope with undulations.

The 2.8-litre engine is characterful, with good refinement at cruising speeds. However, German rivals still offer a more rounded package. It is been a long time coming, but Saab's latest car is already behind the times on the road.
Piers Ward


**GM should have brought this over instead of the Saaburu 9-2x.  Thoughts?

[ifcar]

I thought the US was getting it. They killed that idea?

[BMWDave]

I thought the US was getting it. They killed that idea?

I am not sure of that...what I meant by my statement was the GM shouldnt have rushed the 9-2x into Saab duty when they have this 9-3 sport wagon that will essentially compete with it anyway and is much more "saab" like.

[ifcar]

I thought the US was getting it. They killed that idea?

I am not sure of that...what I meant by my statement was the GM shouldnt have rushed the 9-2x into Saab duty when they have this 9-3 sport wagon that will essentially compete with it anyway and is much more "saab" like.

I see, it looked like you were saying that the 9-2X was brought out instead of the 9-3 wagon.  

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

[BMWDave]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

[TBR]

As much as I like traditional SAABs, I really think AWD would be a good idea for cars this powerful (but, RWD wouldn't be).  

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

[BMWDave]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

[BMWDave]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.  

[SJ_GTI]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.    

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

[BMWDave]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

[BMWDave]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

[BMWDave]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

[TBR]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

I don't think that FWD itself is one of SAAB's trademark traits, rather I think it is the all weather capability that comes with FWD, something AWD would only improve on.  

[TBR]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

For a little while anyway, but GM doesn't have enough money to make a three sets of really good sports/luxury sedans right now, and I am guessing SAAB would be the one getting the short end of the stick. But, a genuine, quirky SAAB would have to be really horrible to drive away SAAB loyalists.  

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

For a little while anyway, but GM doesn't have enough money to make a three sets of really good sports/luxury sedans right now, and I am guessing SAAB would be the one getting the short end of the stick. But, a genuine, quirky SAAB would have to be really horrible to drive away SAAB loyalists.

saab needs every sale they can get.

[TBR]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

For a little while anyway, but GM doesn't have enough money to make a three sets of really good sports/luxury sedans right now, and I am guessing SAAB would be the one getting the short end of the stick. But, a genuine, quirky SAAB would have to be really horrible to drive away SAAB loyalists.

saab needs every sale they can get.

SAAB should be the least of GM's worrys right now, they have turned a profit numerous times over the past few years (where is Mick when you need him, he would have more info), something that can't be said for Saturn, and they have very high buyer loyality. .  

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

For a little while anyway, but GM doesn't have enough money to make a three sets of really good sports/luxury sedans right now, and I am guessing SAAB would be the one getting the short end of the stick. But, a genuine, quirky SAAB would have to be really horrible to drive away SAAB loyalists.

saab needs every sale they can get.

SAAB should be the least of GM's worrys right now, they have turned a profit numerous times over the past few years (where is Mick when you need him, he would have more info), something that can't be said for Saturn, and they have very high buyer loyality. .

saturn is taken care of though. they have the sky and aura coming up. saab has nothing.

[JWC]

The problem with Saab trying to build a "mainstream" car, one that appeals to the masses, is that it then, just becomes another car.

Saab, as mentioned, is a niche marque. GM has come close to ruining Saab.  Saab has been dependent on owner loyalty for decades. Saab lovers will spend more for a Saab because they could depend on it to be well engineered. But, since GM bought Saab out, it has become more GM and less Saab.  As this happens more and more, Saab loyalists will not buy new Saabs, but buy genuine mainstream cars and restore older Saabs.  

Over the past several months, I'm realizing I'm at this point now. I've been looking for a project car and I'm asking myself, should I find an old 900 or 9000 and restore it for myself and let the wife have the 9-5? The more GM slowly infects Saab with its corporate mindset of "sameness", I know I won't buy a new one.

If I wanted a Suburu, I'd buy a Suburu. If I wanted a Trailblazer, I'd buy a Trailblazer. But, I and many other Saab owners, won't buy a Suburu badged as a Saab simply because the griffin is on the hood.

Saab needs more customers, true. But,  people are not going to buy a Saab simply because it is now some beancounter's idea of mainstream.  What would happen then is that Saab will lose its customer base, not win over converts. After that it will truly fail.

[TBR]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

For a little while anyway, but GM doesn't have enough money to make a three sets of really good sports/luxury sedans right now, and I am guessing SAAB would be the one getting the short end of the stick. But, a genuine, quirky SAAB would have to be really horrible to drive away SAAB loyalists.

saab needs every sale they can get.

SAAB should be the least of GM's worrys right now, they have turned a profit numerous times over the past few years (where is Mick when you need him, he would have more info), something that can't be said for Saturn, and they have very high buyer loyality. .

saturn is taken care of though. they have the sky and aura coming up. saab has nothing.

SAAB has two good, if not exceptional, sports sedans that are quite successful amoung their loyalists. Saturn has one great car coming and one car that will probably be just good, but they also don't have nearly as much brand recognition and they have to move more units simply because their cars are a lot cheaper.  

[Raghavan]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

For a little while anyway, but GM doesn't have enough money to make a three sets of really good sports/luxury sedans right now, and I am guessing SAAB would be the one getting the short end of the stick. But, a genuine, quirky SAAB would have to be really horrible to drive away SAAB loyalists.

saab needs every sale they can get.

SAAB should be the least of GM's worrys right now, they have turned a profit numerous times over the past few years (where is Mick when you need him, he would have more info), something that can't be said for Saturn, and they have very high buyer loyality. .

saturn is taken care of though. they have the sky and aura coming up. saab has nothing.

SAAB has two good, if not exceptional, sports sedans that are quite successful amoung their loyalists. Saturn has one great car coming and one car that will probably be just good, but they also don't have nearly as much brand recognition and they have to move more units simply because their cars are a lot cheaper.

saturn also has the no haggle and friendly dealership going for them.

[TBR]

why didn't they just build this off of the legacy?

Because then it loses its identity as a saab.

saves them development on AWD, which it needs.

But a Saab is not just about AWD...Saabs have a whole character to them, and thats why you really cant view the 9-2x as a Saab, even if it comes with AWD.

but saab's broken their FWD tradition...

Exactly my point...something that they should not have done.

Audi broke its FWD tradition with Quattro. That turned out okay.  

maybe saab can become like audi.

Saab has a cult like following that I dont think Audi has....they are extreme brand loyalists, and GM is pissing off a lot of Saab fans by taking away the Saabness of their new cars.

but what's wrong with pissing off a few loyalists for a lot more new customers?

its obviously not working for Saab, as they are almost on the brink of getting killed off by GM.  They need to develop cars that have unique personalities, not badge engineered WRXs and Trailblazers.

they need to make something more mainstream... something that'll appeal to everyone.

Thats not exactly true...Saab gained a reputation by building quirky cars, not cars for the masses.

they'd get more sales though.

For a little while anyway, but GM doesn't have enough money to make a three sets of really good sports/luxury sedans right now, and I am guessing SAAB would be the one getting the short end of the stick. But, a genuine, quirky SAAB would have to be really horrible to drive away SAAB loyalists.

saab needs every sale they can get.

SAAB should be the least of GM's worrys right now, they have turned a profit numerous times over the past few years (where is Mick when you need him, he would have more info), something that can't be said for Saturn, and they have very high buyer loyality. .

saturn is taken care of though. they have the sky and aura coming up. saab has nothing.

SAAB has two good, if not exceptional, sports sedans that are quite successful amoung their loyalists. Saturn has one great car coming and one car that will probably be just good, but they also don't have nearly as much brand recognition and they have to move more units simply because their cars are a lot cheaper.

saturn also has the no haggle and friendly dealership going for them.

SAAB also has a very good dealers, though they could use more of them (that is one of the biggest factors in their low sales numbers).