GM Plans First Light Duty V-8 Clean Diesel for North America

[VetteZ06]

http://media.gm.com/servlet/GatewayServlet?target=http://image.emerald.gm.com/gmnews/viewpressreldetail.do?domain=2&docid=37112

I'd love to have a diesel in a half-ton Silverado or Sierra.

[S204STi]

 

[GoCougs]

"The new dual-overhead cam, four-valve V-8 diesel engine will fit within the same space of a small-block V-8 gasoline engine."

LOL - 'Bout time GM, even if it is in an oil burner...

But a diesel in a half-ton? Interesting differentiator, but I'm skeptical of the affect on the market.

Diesel advantages don't really play well to the half-ton market - especially as a premium option.

[93JC]

But a diesel in a half-ton? Interesting differentiator, but I'm skeptical of the affect on the market.

Diesel advantages don't really play well to the half-ton market - especially as a premium option.

"Most fuel economical half-ton on the market!"



Might work, IMO, if they keep the price-premium small enough.

Oh, and if it's not balls-slow.

[RomanChariot]

?This new V-8 is not only a clean diesel meeting the toughest emissions requirements in North America, it also delivers an effortless performance feel because of its high torque across the speed range,? said Charlie Freese, executive director of GM Powertrain Diesel Engineering. ?It is also significantly quieter than other diesels on the road today, with noise and vibration performance approaching gasoline V-8 levels.?

"The premium V-8 diesel engine is expected to deliver class-leading refinement, horsepower and torque and fulfill multiple vehicle applications with ratings in excess of 310 horsepower and 520 lb-ft of torque."

All of that plus a 25% increase in fuel economy versus the gasoline engine.  Put this in a Suburban and sign me up.

[SJ_GTI]

Can't wait to see how a tahoe with this engine compares in fuel economy to a hybrid tahoe.

[GoCougs]

"Most fuel economical half-ton on the market!"



Might work, IMO, if they keep the price-premium small enough.

Oh, and if it's not balls-slow.

The current Duramax is a $7,195 option, so the prospect of "small" doesn't look so good.

Of note, this premium doesn't prevent Detroit from selling loads and loads of 3/4- and 1-ton diesels.

Whose to know. The American new car buyer is a strange animal indeed.

[VetteZ06]

"The new dual-overhead cam, four-valve V-8 diesel engine will fit within the same space of a small-block V-8 gasoline engine."

LOL - 'Bout time GM, even if it is in an oil burner...

But a diesel in a half-ton? Interesting differentiator, but I'm skeptical of the affect on the market.

Diesel advantages don't really play well to the half-ton market - especially as a premium option.

GoCougs, skeptical of GM? What?

[SVT666]

But a diesel in a half-ton? Interesting differentiator, but I'm skeptical of the affect on the market.

Diesel advantages don't really play well to the half-ton market - especially as a premium option.

GM offered diesels in the 1/2 tons for quite a few years.

[S204STi]

The current Duramax is a $7,195 option, so the prospect of "small" doesn't look so good.

Of note, this premium doesn't prevent Detroit from selling loads and loads of 3/4- and 1-ton diesels.

Whose to know. The American new car buyer is a strange animal indeed.

Part of the price premium is the $4000 Allison M1000 transmission.  The 6L80E should be able to handle a smaller diesel (besides the fact that the allison is probably physically too big to fit anyway), so the number you qoute is pretty much irrelevant.  We can only wait and see.

[Michael Estorol]

it'll be interesting to compare this with Ford's LandRover TDV8 (3.6 litre 90deg V8, 306bhp, 472 lbft) which has been getting rave reviews, but probably won't end up in a pickup truck.

[GoCougs]

GM offered diesels in the 1/2 tons for quite a few years.

And reason why they stopped doing it long, long ago.

[S204STi]

And reason why they stopped doing it long, long ago.

I think that had more to do with the failed marketing of diesels in general, and the somewhat so-so performance of the old 6.5 diesels.  A diesel Suburban today would likely do well with rising gas prices (yes, I know you like to spout ad nauseum that fuel prices have no impact, but I hear people complaining about them constantly) and if you offer an economical and refined alternative people will buy it, particularly if they tow.

[SVT666]

And reason why they stopped doing it long, long ago.

Actually it was because GM's 6.5L diesel was a POS.  It was also a time when gas was cheap and people would rather not have a loud diesel that spewed black smoke when they could get a more powerful, quieter, cheaper, and more reliable gas engine.

[GoCougs]

Actually it was because GM's 6.5L diesel was a POS.? It was also a time when gas was cheap and people would rather not have a loud diesel that spewed black smoke when they could get a more powerful, quieter, cheaper, and more reliable gas engine.

Actually, the 6.5L diesel was an okay engine; it was the earlier 6.2L that was the abomination.

[Catman]

Diesels are so much more appropriate in a truck, 1/2 ton or not.  But, they need to make a lot of them to keep the price down.  Not many people are going to pay $4000+ for the option.

[SVT666]

Diesels are so much more appropriate in a truck, 1/2 ton or not.? But, they need to make a lot of them to keep the price down.? Not many people are going to pay $4000+ for the option.

I wouldn't.

[SJ_GTI]

I've seen people mention these large premiums on other forums, and as far as I can tell there isn't much basis for it. This diesel was designed for every day use, not the heavy duty versions. Its far more likely it will have a similar markup that other "normal" diesels, around 2k USD.

And then, even if you still wouldn't pay the premium, I am sure others will. Variety is the spice of life! I am glad to see more automakers introducing diesels (or at least planning them).

[SVT666]

I've seen people mention these large premiums on other forums, and as far as I can tell there isn't much basis for it. This diesel was designed for every day use, not the heavy duty versions. Its far more likely it will have a similar markup that other "normal" diesels, around 2k USD.

Is that just for the engine?  The transmissions are usually another $2000 aren't they?

[SJ_GTI]

Is that just for the engine?? The transmissions are usually another $2000 aren't they?

Normal light-duty diesels don't require special transmissions. The Jetta TDI uses the same automatic as a Jetta 2.0T. The E320 CDI uses the same transmission as the E350.

I would think that if they are building an engine to fit exactly where a SBC would go, that its just as likely it will use the same transmission.

I thinik part of the issue is that not many companies offer light duty diesels in north america, so people are assuming this engine will be closer to the heavy duty diesels. I think it will be closer to the diesels offered in the Touareg than the diesel in the HD Trucks.

[GoCougs]

My bet is that it will be at least $5,000, if not match the current 6.6L Duramax's $7,195 premium.

Most diesels are not power-equivalent replacements; E320 BT, Jetta TDI, etc. These are relatively small and/or low-power engines relative to the other engines available in the respective models.

Not so with this engine. It will be superior or equivalent in power to all but the 6.0L V8.

A good analogy beyond the 6.6L Duramax is the price premimum of the Toureg V10 TDI.

[TBR]

The E320 is only a couple of tenths slower than the E350 and only costs $1000 or so more (and has about the most advanced diesel available), off of that I am thinking the difference will be more like $2000-3000.

[S204STi]

Is that just for the engine?? The transmissions are usually another $2000 aren't they?

I really doubt the Allison M1000 would fit.  Even then, the 6L80E is supposed to deal with Corvette levels of power, and I don't see this 4.5L diesel putting out much more than 400ft/lbs of torque.  In other words, the Allison would be overkill.

[SJ_GTI]

I really doubt the Allison M1000 would fit.? Even then, the 6L80E is supposed to deal with Corvette levels of power, and I don't see this 4.5L diesel putting out much more than 400ft/lbs of torque.? In other words, the Allison would be overkill.

According to GM, it should put out upwards of 520 lb-ft of torque

[SVT666]

According to GM, it should put out upwards of 520 lb-ft of torque

Out of a 4.5L?  That's awesome.

[SJ_GTI]

Seems pretty standard. VW's 2.0TDI will put out 235 lb-ft, and GM's own 2.9 V6 TDI will put out 406 lb-ft. I think VW already has a 3.0 TDI that makes 369 lb-ft of torque.

[SVT666]

Seems pretty standard. VW's 2.0TDI will put out 235 lb-ft, and GM's own 2.9 V6 TDI will put out 406 lb-ft. I think VW already has a 3.0 TDI that makes 369 lb-ft of torque.

True.

[cozmik]

I would expect that GM would set a price difference goal of $1-2k over the standard gasoline engine for this one. If they did that, and they follow through on that, seeing as it produces about the same power, and a lot more torque than the 5.3L, and should offer a worthwhile increase in fuel economy as well, it should become a popular option.

[SJ_GTI]

I would expect that GM would set a price difference goal of $1-2k over the standard gasoline engine for this one. If they did that, and they follow through on that, seeing as it produces about the same power, and a lot more torque than the 5.3L, and should offer a worthwhile increase in fuel economy as well, it should become a popular option.

I'd expect an increase of 1-2k (maybe even slightly more) compared to the 6.0L, not the 5.3L. I think the 4.5TDI will probably be the range topping engine in their truck line.

[Tave]

I'd expect an increase of 1-2k (maybe even slightly more) compared to the 6.0L, not the 5.3L. I think the 4.5TDI will probably be the range topping engine in their truck line.

Which means it's going to come standard with a lot of goodies, driving the price up even more.