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http://jalopnik.com/watch-nyc-bikers-attack-range-rover-after-driver-runs-o-1427168165 (http://jalopnik.com/watch-nyc-bikers-attack-range-rover-after-driver-runs-o-1427168165)

Black Range Rover Runs Over Bikers in NYC (Original) HD (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNOyDMzn2bY#)

:confused:

Watched that on another site. Don't know what happened before the recording started but,

It looks like they swarmed the truck and got them to stop, prior to stopping you can see a bike next to the drivers side either yelling or talking to them. Once stopped it looks like someone in front gets off the bike and starts moving toward the truck. Apparently the guy had his wife and child in the vehicle, and it's possible he feared for his safety. Of course chasing him down after the incident and trying to open his door or apprehend him only made a bad situation worse.

I've seen this mentality before in large groups of motorcyclists. I admit, I've contemplated the scenario long before I saw this video. My conclusion was the exact thing depicted in this video.

Looks like they were intentionally slowing the Range Rover down, then there was an accidental collision and the bikers escalated the issue and the driver of the Range thought he had to get out of there. 

A swarm of motorcyclists that ended up attacking the vehicle really has me siding with the driver here.  I wouldn't be surprised if they were threatening before the video started and for the portion of the video where we couldn't really see what was going on. 

Quote from: Raza  on September 30, 2013, 02:16:01 PM
Looks like they were intentionally slowing the Range Rover down, then there was an accidental collision and the bikers escalated the issue and the driver of the Range thought he had to get out of there. 

A swarm of motorcyclists that ended up attacking the vehicle really has me siding with the driver here.  I wouldn't be surprised if they were threatening before the video started and for the portion of the video where we couldn't really see what was going on. 

Definitely looked like that first rider tried to cause something. The fact is the rover driver did stop. We don't see clearly why he decided to go again, but escaping a threatening situation may be in fact what he needed to do at that point.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on September 30, 2013, 02:28:55 PM
Definitely looked like that first rider tried to cause something. The fact is the rover driver did stop. We don't see clearly why he decided to go again, but escaping a threatening situation may be in fact what he needed to do at that point.

From what I was reading, there was a second video posted on the Daily Mail that showed that the bikers were attempting to or did open up his door after the original collision.  If I were in a large car with my family on board and a bunch of bikers tried to get into the car, I'd react exactly the same way.  Barrel through and get on the phone to the police. 

Quote from: Raza  on September 30, 2013, 02:37:39 PM
From what I was reading, there was a second video posted on the Daily Mail that showed that the bikers were attempting to or did open up his door after the original collision.  If I were in a large car with my family on board and a bunch of bikers tried to get into the car, I'd react exactly the same way.  Barrel through and get on the phone to the police. 

That's in that video, near the end. They weren't trying to talk to him. They sure as hell weren't just trying to get a license plate and call the cops, and the only person that ended up in the hospital about this was the Rover driver. Whatever happened right at the first may be debatable(sure as hell looks like the rider was trying to brake check the dude and tapped; not hit, not run over; tapped), but what happened after isn't.

This is the kind of situation that could have gotten a lot worse very easily.

This vid makes me angry. I hate "bikers" like this

It's hard to tell what started the problem.  We see bikers whipping closely by on either side of the SUV and one guy who virtually stops in front of it on what looks like a three lane highway.  From that perspective the bikers appear to have started the whole thing. 

What happened before this clip?  I'd bet it doesn't make the bikers look like model citizens or it would have been included by the biker that posted it.  Riding like a pack of dicks is hardly a way to gain respect.  Note that about halfway through the clip a biker in a red jacket in the right lane flips the finger at a motorist trying to enter the highway.

That's a mess!! I've seen shit like this happens and it's usually after a car damn near hits a biker! If the guy in the Rover didn't do anything wrong he shudda B Lined to the nearest police station or been on the phone calling for help! I can understand the anger especially after this guy has run over bikes at least 3 times!!! But in the end its just sad to see a day of fun turn into something like this!

Certainly could have been much worse. The obvious thought is that if the driver were armed he would have had plenty of cause to fire on the guy breaking his window. Also another rider starts hitting the drivers side passenger window. If he had a child in the vehicle that would be pretty obvious intent to harm everyone in the car.

Frankly, it looks like these bikers are your standard bunch of "safety in numbers" cocks that swarm around on the highways. Looking to intimidate and "own" the road. They are lucky 3 or 4 of them didn't go home in body bags with a few slugs in them.

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on September 30, 2013, 04:38:36 PM
That's a mess!! I've seen shit like this happens and it's usually after a car damn near hits a biker! If the guy in the Rover didn't do anything wrong he shudda B Lined to the nearest police station or been on the phone calling for help! I can understand the anger especially after this guy has run over bikes at least 3 times!!! But in the end its just sad to see a day of fun turn into something like this!

This happened in a span of 5 minutes(from the start of the video/incident, until he was stopped in traffic). Cops wouldn't have responded that fast(and if they did, probably couldn't get through the bikers). I would, however, be interested to hear the 911 call this man or his wife(if she was with him) made for assistance. If they called at all.

I just read that the driver ended up in the hospital.

"I saw these guys yesterday, the bikers, and what a pack of assholes they were. Splitting lanes on the highway at speed (70mph between 2 cars), cutting people off. They had me boxed in so I couldn't get out of an exit only lane so they could get off. Not saying they deserve to be hit, but they had it coming.

I had my blinker on and was handsignalling I needed to get out of the exit only lane. everyone kept passing on the left to cut me off in front of the exit, 4-5 of them flipped me off. I tried rolling slow but they had no inkling of how to ride well. I ride myself, and this was just heinous."

Sounds like a group of jackasses to me.

Just some context, this was a huge bike rally w/no kind of permits or input from the city

Cops actually came out to break it up

Had it been official the cops would have left a lane for RR dude and the rest of traffic to move on and avoid this whole situation.

Dude shouldn't have ran over the bikes but the bikers 100% created the situation and were fucking idiots.

idiot bikers.  gotta love the fact that one of their own (dumbass who filmed it) is gonna be the one who hangs his buddies

Another case for right to carry...

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on September 30, 2013, 04:38:36 PM
But in the end its just sad to see a day of fun turn into something like this!

From what I understand, this isn't a "day of fun," but rather a criminal convention. The cops have denied permits for them to have this "bike weekend" on public NYC streets for years, and there are a bunch of people arrested every time they come anyway. This year they also confiscated 55 bikes.

It sounds more like a bunch of thugs causing trouble than anything else...

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on September 30, 2013, 07:53:48 PM
Dude shouldn't have ran over the bikes but the bikers 100% created the situation and were fucking idiots.

What else could he have done, though? Staying still in the car while an angry mob is there punching in the windows didn't work out too well for Reginald Denny. If a group had me surrounded and was trying to bust in my windows I'd floor it and hope I could get to safety. At that point, it's a life or death situation.

Who knows how this got to this point, but running over bikes, nearly killing several riders... all of that was needless escalation.  If he was really trying to just protect himself, getting on the horn with the Police and meeting a trooper on the road makes more sense.

Is there anything else the driver could have done in this situation?  What would you have done? (If the driver isn't the aggressor, which in this case he may have been)

I'm not really sure what I'd do if I had a group of bikers after me with a wife and kid in the car

Quote from: S204STi on September 30, 2013, 11:16:11 PM
Who knows how this got to this point, but running over bikes, nearly killing several riders... all of that was needless escalation.  If he was really trying to just protect himself, getting on the horn with the Police and meeting a trooper on the road makes more sense.

I don't think the police could have responded that fast

Quote from: S204STi on September 30, 2013, 11:16:11 PM
Who knows how this got to this point, but running over bikes, nearly killing several riders... all of that was needless escalation.  If he was really trying to just protect himself, getting on the horn with the Police and meeting a trooper on the road makes more sense.

And the cops might have been there in time to wash the blood off the road. Might not have been.

Sorry, but I'm not going to blame the guy for not waiting around to find out.

Quote from: S204STi on September 30, 2013, 11:16:11 PM
Who knows how this got to this point, but running over bikes, nearly killing several riders... all of that was needless escalation.  If he was really trying to just protect himself, getting on the horn with the Police and meeting a trooper on the road makes more sense.

How could the police get to him? The bikes set up a huge barrier around him.

Something else to note: a LOT of the dirt bikes + quads out there were not legal. Whoever said this was a criminal convention was on the money.

This idea that in any kind of car + bike confrontation the biker is always innocent is false. These guys make a legit case for the outright banning of bikes, if not much more stringent licensing etc...

Yeah what the hell's up with all the dirt bikes? Why would anyone in NYC have a dirt bike?  Are there trails in Central Park? :lol:

What I'm saying is that his response points to a sense of guilt.  If I had accidentally tapped that first rider in the film, I would have stopped, gotten out, and attended to him, regardless of his pals.  It's just the right thing to do.  The fact that he launches over three or four bikes afterward in an attempt to get away, is evidence in my mind that he knew he was in deep shit because of what he just did.  I'm not necessarily defending the rally, because frankly I can't stand them and the way it fucks up road travel, but ramming a cyclist is the penultimate road rage expression in response to an inconvenience.

Quote from: S204STi on October 01, 2013, 07:22:08 AM
What I'm saying is that his response points to a sense of guilt.  If I had accidentally tapped that first rider in the film, I would have stopped, gotten out, and attended to him, regardless of his pals.  It's just the right thing to do.  The fact that he launches over three or four bikes afterward in an attempt to get away, is evidence in my mind that he knew he was in deep shit because of what he just did.  I'm not necessarily defending the rally, because frankly I can't stand them and the way it fucks up road travel, but ramming a cyclist is the penultimate road rage expression in response to an inconvenience.

He did stop, though, didn't he? For whatever reason (unclear on this video, clearer on others), he decided he needed to get out of there, and the actions and attitudes of the bikers around him make me think something was going on ,ore than just being inconvenienced.

Oh, and do we have to mention again that the Rover driver was the only party in this that ended up in the hospital?

Quote from: S204STi on October 01, 2013, 07:22:08 AM
What I'm saying is that his response points to a sense of guilt.  If I had accidentally tapped that first rider in the film, I would have stopped, gotten out, and attended to him, regardless of his pals.  It's just the right thing to do.  The fact that he launches over three or four bikes afterward in an attempt to get away, is evidence in my mind that he knew he was in deep shit because of what he just did.  I'm not necessarily defending the rally, because frankly I can't stand them and the way it fucks up road travel, but ramming a cyclist is the penultimate road rage expression in response to an inconvenience.

The dude was assaulted/slashed by one of the bikers, IIRC, before he ran over the bikes. Its easy to say, 'he should have stayed calm and did x y z' but this was a clear fight or flight situation, created entirely by these goofy ass bikers.

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on October 01, 2013, 07:49:27 AM
The dude was assaulted/slashed by one of the bikers, IIRC, before he ran over the bikes. Its easy to say, 'he should have stayed calm and did x y z' but this was a clear fight or flight situation, created entirely by these goofy ass bikers.

I'm not entirely sure exactly when the driver was slashed, but even if he was attacked afterwards, that surely goes towards the position that he was in danger before.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 01, 2013, 07:25:33 AM
He did stop, though, didn't he? For whatever reason (unclear on this video, clearer on others), he decided he needed to get out of there, and the actions and attitudes of the bikers around him make me think something was going on ,ore than just being inconvenienced.

Oh, and do we have to mention again that the Rover driver was the only party in this that ended up in the hospital?

One report said one of the bikers suffered a broken leg.  That probably required hospitalization.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 01, 2013, 08:15:27 AM
One report said one of the bikers suffered a broken leg.  That probably required hospitalization.

And other reports that multiple people were killed. I'm not going to trust youtube commentators on this.

And if one of them was injured, well; he probably deserved it.

Quote from: S204STi on September 30, 2013, 11:16:11 PM
Who knows how this got to this point, but running over bikes, nearly killing several riders... all of that was needless escalation.  If he was really trying to just protect himself, getting on the horn with the Police and meeting a trooper on the road makes more sense.

The needless escalation was the one biker dick stopping his crotch rocket in front of the SUV.

Yeah, better to stay there and get the crap beat out of yourself and your family.

the cops don't teleport into the scene of the crime.  it takes time to ge there.  What's going to happen to this guy and his family while 911 transfers information to the police andthey respond.   

I suspect he was really hoping a police office would happen along during the 6 minutes of that video.  It would have been really interesting to see how 1 squad car and 1 or 2 cops would have calmed that mob.

Quote from: S204STi on October 01, 2013, 07:22:08 AM
What I'm saying is that his response points to a sense of guilt.  If I had accidentally tapped that first rider in the film, I would have stopped, gotten out, and attended to him, regardless of his pals.  It's just the right thing to do.  The fact that he launches over three or four bikes afterward in an attempt to get away, is evidence in my mind that he knew he was in deep shit because of what he just did.  I'm not necessarily defending the rally, because frankly I can't stand them and the way it fucks up road travel, but ramming a cyclist is the penultimate road rage expression in response to an inconvenience.

Or he feared for the safety of his wife and child,not to mention his own safety. 

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on September 30, 2013, 04:14:56 PM
This vid makes me angry. I hate "bikers" like this

Yup.  They make you all look bad.  And I mean "you all" as in motorcycle riders, not black people this time. :lol:

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 01, 2013, 08:22:17 AM
And other reports that multiple people were killed. I'm not going to trust youtube commentators on this.

And if one of them was injured, well; he probably deserved it.

Strongly agree with your last statement.  From the CBS new site (looks like one biker got it pretty good and another less so):

NEW YORK (CBSNewYork) – Police are looking for a group of bikers who they say are wanted in connection with an attack of a driver after chasing his SUV on the highway through Manhattan.

The NYPD released a photo early Tuesday morning of two bikers who investigators said were part of the melee. One driver has Guyana flag on the tail end of his bike and the other has a black and white design, police said.

Police said it happened Sunday on the Henry Hudson Parkway. Video of the incident, which appeared to be taken from a camera mounted on another biker's helmet, was posted to YouTube early Monday morning.


Two suspects who police say are wanted for beating up the driver of a SUV in Manhattan on Sunday, Sept. 29, 2013. (credit: NYPD)

Alexian Lien, 33, was driving his Range Rover with his wife and infant daughter in the car when police said one of the motorcycles slowed down in front of his SUV, causing a collision.

That's when at about 30 seconds into the video, the large group of bikers are seen coming to a complete stop on the highway, surrounding the Range Rover.

"They take their helmets and they start to dent his car and apparently his tires are slashed there," Police Commissioner Ray Kelly said.

Lien then hits the gas, plowing over two motorcyclists, police said.

For the next several minutes of the video, the bikers can be seen chasing the Range Rover for about 2 miles until the SUV gets off the highway at around West 178th Street and St. Nicholas Avenue, police said.

As Lien gets stuck in traffic, the bikers surround him again, police said. One of the riders is then seen in the video jumping off his bike, ripping off his helmet and using it to bash in the driver's side window.

A second biker is also seen running up and hitting the driver's side rear window with his fists.

At this point, the video stops but police said the attack continues.

Kelly said Lien is taken is out of his car and assaulted.

Witnesses described what they saw.

"He got off his bike and started attacking the person in the Range Rover with his helmet, breaking the windows and after they got him out of his car, they beat him up," said witness Christopher Quinones.

Lien was taken to the hospital where he needed stitches to his face. His wife and child were unhurt.

Police said a biker suffered two broken legs after the SUV ran over him and another suffered a leg injury. But the wife of one of the injured bikers said her husband is paralyzed and in a coma, WBZ-TV reported.

Dayana Mieses, the wife of Edwin Mieses, said her husband got off his bike to help an injured biker who was hit in the initial collision.

"He went to help someone," Dayana told WBZ-TV Tuesday morning.

Mieses said her husband has injuries to his heart, lungs and ribs and that he is paralyzed from the waist down. The couple has two children, ages 15 and 9.

"That man paralyzed my husband," Mieses said about Lien. "He needs to pay for what he did."

Mieses works in studio engineering in the music business, WBZ-TV reported. Friends call him Jay Meezee and have created a Facebook page for him.

Police said the bikers are part of a group called the "Hollywood Stuntz." This was apparently part of an annual ride designed to draw attention and make it into Times Square.

"This is a major stunt event where motorcyclists from various locations come together," Kelly said. "Quite frankly it wasn't on anybody's radar screen last year. We were aware of it this year."

In order to prevent the group from heading into Times Square this year, police set up checkpoints throughout the city. Kelly said during that effort, 15 arrests were made, 68 summonses were issues and 55 motorcycles were confiscated.

Police said the biker who was involved in the initial accident, Christopher Cruz, was arrested Tuesday on reckless endangerment, reckless driving, endangering the welfare of a child and menacing charges.

Lien has not been charged.

Anyone with information is asked to call Crime Stoppers at 1-800-577-TIPS (8477), visit CrimeStoppers.com or by text tips to 274637 (CRIMES) then enter TIP577.

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on September 30, 2013, 07:53:48 PM
Just some context, this was a huge bike rally w/no kind of permits or input from the city

Cops actually came out to break it up

Had it been official the cops would have left a lane for RR dude and the rest of traffic to move on and avoid this whole situation.

Dude shouldn't have ran over the bikes but the bikers 100% created the situation and were fucking idiots.

If you're surrounded by angry bikers with your family and feel threatened, running over them to get the hell out of there is 100% the right decision.

On a somewhat comical note, I laughed when they got the suv stopped the second time on the freeway and some dummy on a dirt bike moves in front of the suv. What a brilliant idea, since this guy just ran down a few motorcycles I figure I might as well try to block him with my bike.

Quote from: Raza  on October 01, 2013, 08:36:40 AM
If you're surrounded by angry bikers with your family and feel threatened, running over them to get the hell out of there is 100% the right decision.

Yup, armchair critique after the fact as to the severity of the threat is always worthless.

This SUV driver had NO WAY of knowing that one of these guys wasn't armed and wouldn't start firing on his vehicle. Sure, since that didn't happen we could assume the threat wasn't there. From the drivers standpoint, in that situation, at that single moment it no doubt was a very real possibility.

Quote from: S204STi on September 30, 2013, 11:16:11 PM
Who knows how this got to this point, but running over bikes, nearly killing several riders... all of that was needless escalation.  If he was really trying to just protect himself, getting on the horn with the Police and meeting a trooper on the road makes more sense.

When 30-50 people are swarming your car, you really think honking your horn and waiting for a cop is the right idea?  It wasn't on video, but clearly there was something going on after the initial contact that prompted the SUV driver to slam on the gas and feel like he needed to get away.  It looks like pure jackassery on the part of the bikers by getting in front of him and slowing him down, which then led to the contact.  Running them over wasn't escalation, it was escape.  It's not like he backed up over them, I think it was clear that he was trying to get away.

Quote from: S204STi on October 01, 2013, 07:22:08 AM
What I'm saying is that his response points to a sense of guilt.  If I had accidentally tapped that first rider in the film, I would have stopped, gotten out, and attended to him, regardless of his pals.  It's just the right thing to do.  The fact that he launches over three or four bikes afterward in an attempt to get away, is evidence in my mind that he knew he was in deep shit because of what he just did.  I'm not necessarily defending the rally, because frankly I can't stand them and the way it fucks up road travel, but ramming a cyclist is the penultimate road rage expression in response to an inconvenience.

You're giving these guys way too much credit.  Look at the way the biker got in front of his car and was turned all the way around and was looking at the driver when the contact happened.  There's no way the bikers are innocent in the initial contact. 

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 01, 2013, 08:34:44 AM
Strongly agree with your last statement.  From the CBS new site (looks like one biker got it pretty good and another less so):

NEW YORK (CBSNewYork) – Police are looking for a group of bikers who they say are wanted in connection with an attack of a driver after chasing his SUV on the highway through Manhattan.

The NYPD released a photo early Tuesday morning of two bikers who investigators said were part of the melee. One driver has Guyana flag on the tail end of his bike and the other has a black and white design, police said.

Police said it happened Sunday on the Henry Hudson Parkway. Video of the incident, which appeared to be taken from a camera mounted on another biker's helmet, was posted to YouTube early Monday morning.


Two suspects who police say are wanted for beating up the driver of a SUV in Manhattan on Sunday, Sept. 29, 2013. (credit: NYPD)

Alexian Lien, 33, was driving his Range Rover with his wife and infant daughter in the car when police said one of the motorcycles slowed down in front of his SUV, causing a collision.

That's when at about 30 seconds into the video, the large group of bikers are seen coming to a complete stop on the highway, surrounding the Range Rover.

"They take their helmets and they start to dent his car and apparently his tires are slashed there," Police Commissioner Ray Kelly said.

Lien then hits the gas, plowing over two motorcyclists, police said.

For the next several minutes of the video, the bikers can be seen chasing the Range Rover for about 2 miles until the SUV gets off the highway at around West 178th Street and St. Nicholas Avenue, police said.

As Lien gets stuck in traffic, the bikers surround him again, police said. One of the riders is then seen in the video jumping off his bike, ripping off his helmet and using it to bash in the driver's side window.

A second biker is also seen running up and hitting the driver's side rear window with his fists.

At this point, the video stops but police said the attack continues.

Kelly said Lien is taken is out of his car and assaulted.

Witnesses described what they saw.

"He got off his bike and started attacking the person in the Range Rover with his helmet, breaking the windows and after they got him out of his car, they beat him up," said witness Christopher Quinones.

Lien was taken to the hospital where he needed stitches to his face. His wife and child were unhurt.

Police said a biker suffered two broken legs after the SUV ran over him and another suffered a leg injury. But the wife of one of the injured bikers said her husband is paralyzed and in a coma, WBZ-TV reported.

Dayana Mieses, the wife of Edwin Mieses, said her husband got off his bike to help an injured biker who was hit in the initial collision.

"He went to help someone," Dayana told WBZ-TV Tuesday morning.

Mieses said her husband has injuries to his heart, lungs and ribs and that he is paralyzed from the waist down. The couple has two children, ages 15 and 9.

"That man paralyzed my husband," Mieses said about Lien. "He needs to pay for what he did."

Mieses works in studio engineering in the music business, WBZ-TV reported. Friends call him Jay Meezee and have created a Facebook page for him.

Police said the bikers are part of a group called the "Hollywood Stuntz." This was apparently part of an annual ride designed to draw attention and make it into Times Square.

"This is a major stunt event where motorcyclists from various locations come together," Kelly said. "Quite frankly it wasn't on anybody's radar screen last year. We were aware of it this year."

In order to prevent the group from heading into Times Square this year, police set up checkpoints throughout the city. Kelly said during that effort, 15 arrests were made, 68 summonses were issues and 55 motorcycles were confiscated.

Police said the biker who was involved in the initial accident, Christopher Cruz, was arrested Tuesday on reckless endangerment, reckless driving, endangering the welfare of a child and menacing charges.

Lien has not been charged.

Anyone with information is asked to call Crime Stoppers at 1-800-577-TIPS (8477), visit CrimeStoppers.com or by text tips to 274637 (CRIMES) then enter TIP577.

Again; gonna trust the police over the wife.

Look at what she says; he was injured trying to help someone. Bullshit. Until the RR driver goes over the bikes, there's nobody that needs help.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 01, 2013, 08:54:01 AM
Again; gonna trust the police over the wife.

Look at what she says; he was injured trying to help someone. Bullshit. Until the RR driver goes over the bikes, there's nobody that needs help.

And yet:

"Police said the biker who was involved in the initial accident, Christopher Cruz, was arrested Tuesday on reckless endangerment, reckless driving, endangering the welfare of a child and menacing charges."

Fuck 'em.  100% with the driver here until I hear something pretty convincing otherwise.

And if there was a guy laying in the road paralyzed, it's utterly heart warming to see how all his fellow riders stay to aid him, instead of going off chasing the guy and acting like thugs.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 01, 2013, 08:34:44 AM
Strongly agree with your last statement.  From the CBS new site (looks like one biker got it pretty good and another less so):

NEW YORK (CBSNewYork) – Police are looking for a group of bikers who they say are wanted in connection with an attack of a driver after chasing his SUV on the highway through Manhattan.

The NYPD released a photo early Tuesday morning of two bikers who investigators said were part of the melee. One driver has Guyana flag on the tail end of his bike and the other has a black and white design, police said.

Police said it happened Sunday on the Henry Hudson Parkway. Video of the incident, which appeared to be taken from a camera mounted on another biker's helmet, was posted to YouTube early Monday morning.


Two suspects who police say are wanted for beating up the driver of a SUV in Manhattan on Sunday, Sept. 29, 2013. (credit: NYPD)

Alexian Lien, 33, was driving his Range Rover with his wife and infant daughter in the car when police said one of the motorcycles slowed down in front of his SUV, causing a collision.

That's when at about 30 seconds into the video, the large group of bikers are seen coming to a complete stop on the highway, surrounding the Range Rover.

"They take their helmets and they start to dent his car and apparently his tires are slashed there," Police Commissioner Ray Kelly said.

Lien then hits the gas, plowing over two motorcyclists, police said.

For the next several minutes of the video, the bikers can be seen chasing the Range Rover for about 2 miles until the SUV gets off the highway at around West 178th Street and St. Nicholas Avenue, police said.

As Lien gets stuck in traffic, the bikers surround him again, police said. One of the riders is then seen in the video jumping off his bike, ripping off his helmet and using it to bash in the driver's side window.

A second biker is also seen running up and hitting the driver's side rear window with his fists.

At this point, the video stops but police said the attack continues.

Kelly said Lien is taken is out of his car and assaulted.

Witnesses described what they saw.

"He got off his bike and started attacking the person in the Range Rover with his helmet, breaking the windows and after they got him out of his car, they beat him up," said witness Christopher Quinones.

Lien was taken to the hospital where he needed stitches to his face. His wife and child were unhurt.

Police said a biker suffered two broken legs after the SUV ran over him and another suffered a leg injury. But the wife of one of the injured bikers said her husband is paralyzed and in a coma, WBZ-TV reported.

Dayana Mieses, the wife of Edwin Mieses, said her husband got off his bike to help an injured biker who was hit in the initial collision.

"He went to help someone," Dayana told WBZ-TV Tuesday morning.

Mieses said her husband has injuries to his heart, lungs and ribs and that he is paralyzed from the waist down. The couple has two children, ages 15 and 9.

"That man paralyzed my husband," Mieses said about Lien. "He needs to pay for what he did."

Mieses works in studio engineering in the music business, WBZ-TV reported. Friends call him Jay Meezee and have created a Facebook page for him.

Police said the bikers are part of a group called the "Hollywood Stuntz." This was apparently part of an annual ride designed to draw attention and make it into Times Square.

"This is a major stunt event where motorcyclists from various locations come together," Kelly said. "Quite frankly it wasn't on anybody's radar screen last year. We were aware of it this year."

In order to prevent the group from heading into Times Square this year, police set up checkpoints throughout the city. Kelly said during that effort, 15 arrests were made, 68 summonses were issues and 55 motorcycles were confiscated.

Police said the biker who was involved in the initial accident, Christopher Cruz, was arrested Tuesday on reckless endangerment, reckless driving, endangering the welfare of a child and menacing charges.

Lien has not been charged.

Anyone with information is asked to call Crime Stoppers at 1-800-577-TIPS (8477), visit CrimeStoppers.com or by text tips to 274637 (CRIMES) then enter TIP577.

Well, there you go then.  I stand corrected.  Shitheads all around.

Quote from: S204STi on September 30, 2013, 11:16:11 PM
Who knows how this got to this point, but running over bikes, nearly killing several riders... all of that was needless escalation.  If he was really trying to just protect himself, getting on the horn with the Police and meeting a trooper on the road makes more sense.

I'm not sure if you realize where this happened or have ever been on this road before. The Henry Hudson Parkway (also known as the West Side Highway on lower-numbered streets) runs along the west side of Manhattan. This wasn't a situation where you could drive to safety. Eventually, traffic was going to stop or you'd be forced off the road and subject to the whims of the people potentially trying to kill you. Police officers would take a while to get there in NYC traffic on a fall weekend. This isn't the type of highway where there are troopers ready to respond at 90mph to an emergency. You're also passing by 50 city blocks (and NYPD precinct to precinct) in minutes. It is actually a pretty scary place to be involved in any emergency situation.

Quote from: giant_mtb on October 01, 2013, 06:59:11 AM
Yeah what the hell's up with all the dirt bikes? Why would anyone in NYC have a dirt bike?  Are there trails in Central Park? :lol:

Well, there are places to ride dirt bikes within minutes of NYC, but my sense is most of these guys are from the suburbs and came into the city.

It's a shame the RR driver didn't run before they slashed his tires.

It takes a special kind of stupid to brake check an SUV when you're on a bike.  :nutty:

Not to sound like an ass but just because his kid and wife were in the car does that mean he wasn't being a dick head also! Once again I've seen people do some ill things with kids/passengers in the car! Especially towards bikers! They have that "I'm surrounded by metal and I'll run you over!" mindset! These guys didn't just single tis guy out of the blue!!! He's already on film hitting a biker and he's wrong for that no matter how slow the bike was going! If it was one of you guys in a CAR and he tapped you I'm willing to bet you guys would be ready to hand him an ass whooping for being a jackass!!! I would really like to see how all this BS started!

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 01:01:10 PM
Not to sound like an ass but just because his kid and wife were in the car does that mean he wasn't being a dick head also! Once again I've seen people do some ill things with kids/passengers in the car! Especially towards bikers! They have that "I'm surrounded by metal and I'll run you over!" mindset! These guys didn't just single tis guy out of the blue!!! He's already on film hitting a biker and he's wrong for that no matter how slow the bike was going! If it was one of you guys in a CAR and he tapped you I'm willing to bet you guys would be ready to hand him an ass whooping for being a jackass!!! I would really like to see how all this BS started!

The rider brake-checked the SUV. He got in front of him, turned his head around to face the driver, and hit his brakes. He was literally asking to get hit.

Quote from: Vinsanity on October 01, 2013, 01:11:49 PM
The rider brake-checked the SUV. He got in front of him, turned his head around to face the driver, and hit his brakes. He was literally asking to get hit.

I agree he was stupid for pulling that shit but so was the driver for hitting him! These guys handled it all wrong but I'm not gonna say the RR driver didnt do some dumb shit too! Hell I wudda stopped and sat there till they rode away instead of hitting the biker!

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 01:15:57 PM
I agree he was stupid for pulling that shit but so was the driver for hitting him! These guys handled it all wrong but I'm not gonna say the RR driver didnt do some dumb shit too! Hell I wudda stopped and sat there till they rode away instead of hitting the biker!

I doubt that the RR driver hit him on purpose. That's just what happens when someone on a motorcycle swerves in front of a 5,000-lb SUV and slams on his brakes. The RR driver did stop, but the bikers didn't just ride away. Apparently, they started smashing his car with their helmets and slashing his tires. That's when he did what literally anyone else would do. Try to get the fuck outta there.

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 01:01:10 PM
Not to sound like an ass but just because his kid and wife were in the car does that mean he wasn't being a dick head also! Once again I've seen people do some ill things with kids/passengers in the car! Especially towards bikers! They have that "I'm surrounded by metal and I'll run you over!" mindset! These guys didn't just single tis guy out of the blue!!! He's already on film hitting a biker and he's wrong for that no matter how slow the bike was going! If it was one of you guys in a CAR and he tapped you I'm willing to bet you guys would be ready to hand him an ass whooping for being a jackass!!! I would really like to see how all this BS started!

Do you really know that?  Do you really know that they didn't single him out for no reason?  Do you even think that?  Like seriously, when you think about it, do you still think that?  Or is it a knee-jerk reaction to defend these scum because you ride too? 

The biker caused the accident by getting in front of the SUV and hitting the brakes.  That much is clear. 

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 01:15:57 PM
I agree he was stupid for pulling that shit but so was the driver for hitting him! These guys handled it all wrong but I'm not gonna say the RR driver didnt do some dumb shit too! Hell I wudda stopped and sat there till they rode away instead of hitting the biker!

Sorry man bikers were wron here, no matter how you slice it

They should have got a permit

If they didnt get a permit they should have left a lane open for other traffic (as the cops that would have accompanied them would have mandated had they got the permit)

They shouldn't have swarmed this dude

That dude shouldnt have brake checked

Like, there were so many things the motorcyclists did to create this situation, seems silly to push all that to the side to blame the RR guy once he was pushed to his limit

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 01:15:57 PM
I agree he was stupid for pulling that shit but so was the driver for hitting him! These guys handled it all wrong but I'm not gonna say the RR driver didnt do some dumb shit too! Hell I wudda stopped and sat there till they rode away instead of hitting the biker!

My point is that a sportbike can stop much quicker than a 2 ton+ SUV. The RR driver may have not been able to avoid hitting him.

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 01:15:57 PM
I agree he was stupid for pulling that shit but so was the driver for hitting him! These guys handled it all wrong but I'm not gonna say the RR driver didnt do some dumb shit too! Hell I wudda stopped and sat there till they rode away instead of hitting the biker!

Why?  Why do they have the right to force other people to stop or pull over? 

The RR driver was 100% in the right. 

Quote from: Raza  on October 01, 2013, 01:34:07 PM
Do you really know that?  Do you really know that they didn't single him out for no reason?  Do you even think that?  Like seriously, when you think about it, do you still think that?  Or is it a knee-jerk reaction to defend these scum because you ride too? 

The biker caused the accident by getting in front of the SUV and hitting the brakes.  That much is clear. 

dude where do you see me defending them! I've said from beginning that this was handled all wrong! My point is what caused this?!? Do YOU know that the RR driver didn't do some stupid shit to set these guys off? No you don't. I was just saying I've seen shit like this happen and people are alway quick to blame it all on the bikers!and they were defiantly wrong for what they did! After he hit the first biker all they had to do was get his plate and let the police track him down!

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on October 01, 2013, 01:34:46 PM
Sorry man bikers were wron here, no matter how you slice it

They should have got a permit

If they didnt get a permit they should have left a lane open for other traffic (as the cops that would have accompanied them would have mandated had they got the permit)

They shouldn't have swarmed this dude

That dude shouldnt have brake checked

Like, there were so many things the motorcyclists did to create this situation, seems silly to push all that to the side to blame the RR guy once he was pushed to his limit

Even if they had a lane blocked off there's always some cater that breaks the line! So that's no garuantee that someone in a car that feels like they have more rite to be on the road than bikes won't do some dumb shit! And once again I'm talking from almost 30 years of riding and not just this video! I see it all the time!

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 02:52:18 PM
Do YOU know that the RR driver didn't do some stupid shit to set these guys off?

I highly doubt that possibility. Why would someone want to piss off a motorcycle gang? And with their family in the car?

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 01:15:57 PM
I agree he was stupid for pulling that shit but so was the driver for hitting him! These guys handled it all wrong but I'm not gonna say the RR driver didnt do some dumb shit too! Hell I wudda stopped and sat there till they rode away instead of hitting the biker!

Yes, I'm sure the biker who just brake checked him would calmly pull to the side of the road and exchange insurance information. His buddies would surely continue on their way once they made sure everyone was alright.  :devil:

Or, ya know, it could turn out this way:

L.A. Riots Reginald Denny beating (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wc_SgpyJWRY#)

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 02:52:18 PM
Do YOU know that the RR driver didn't do some stupid shit to set these guys off? No you don't.

Local media is reporting (either from witnesses or police) that evidently the RR driver may have gotten in front of the bikes when entering the highway instead of letting them pass, and they took issue with this and began taunting him.

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 02:52:18 PM
dude where do you see me defending them! I've said from beginning that this was handled all wrong! My point is what caused this?!? Do YOU know that the RR driver didn't do some stupid shit to set these guys off? No you don't. I was just saying I've seen shit like this happen and people are alway quick to blame it all on the bikers!and they were defiantly wrong for what they did! After he hit the first biker all they had to do was get his plate and let the police track him down!

Trying to shift blame to the driver is basically the same thing as defending the bikers.  Based on evidence, the SUV driver did nothing wrong and acted completely reasonably in the situation.  And people wouldn't be so quick to blame the bikers if as a group bikers didn't have a history of incidents or near-incidents like this. 

Quote from: TurboDan on October 01, 2013, 03:25:45 PM
Local media is reporting (either from witnesses or police) that evidently the RR driver may have gotten in front of the bikes when entering the highway instead of letting them pass, and they took issue with this and began taunting him.

But with a biker group that big, the RR driver would've had to hold up traffic for at least a min before he can get on the highway, if he's lucky.  And from what I've seen with biker groups that's less than 1/3 the size of this one, they create a lot of disruption to traffic since they take up significantly more space than 4 big rigs basically creating a huge rolling blockade. 

I would say based on everything else posted here, that it's entirely the biker's fault until otherwise proven. 

Quote from: Vinsanity on October 01, 2013, 03:07:31 PM
I highly doubt that possibility. Why would someone want to piss off a motorcycle gang? And with their family in the car?

Hey, it could have happened. Most likely though, the RR driver may have cut one of them off by mistake (the way these idiots are swarming traffic on both sides might make it hard not to). Maybe he looked at one of them funny.

Regardless, None of that justifies the following actions at all. Period.

Quote from: NomisR on October 01, 2013, 03:49:29 PM
But with a biker group that big, the RR driver would've had to hold up traffic for at least a min before he can get on the highway, if he's lucky.  And from what I've seen with biker groups that's less than 1/3 the size of this one, they create a lot of disruption to traffic since they take up significantly more space than 4 big rigs basically creating a huge rolling blockade. 

I would say based on everything else posted here, that it's entirely the biker's fault until otherwise proven. 

Yeah, I think what has been insinuated is that the bikers basically didn't like that this driver didn't stop in his tracks to let them all pass instead of merging on ahead of them. Apparently there were a lot of reports of this group refusing to let cars on the road at the entrances, or off the roads at the exits. Sounds like a rolling shit show. Why the NYPD didn't have stepped up patrols is anyone's guess.

Quote from: Raza  on October 01, 2013, 03:40:02 PMAnd people wouldn't be so quit to blame the bikers if as a group bikers didn't have a history of incidents or near-incidents like this. 

And my point is people in cars do the same thing!
Pickup driver tries to kill motorcyclist. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbTZkZTYkaM#)

This one cuts the guy off and after he gives a kick she runs him down! Is deadly force justified here?
Woman driver tries to kill biker (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Papx1GczfFs#)

This one is totally unprovoked!! I've seen shit like this more than once!
Extreme road rage - Car tries to take out bikers! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXPb3nnqdDo#ws)

So in the end it's not always the bikers that are being assholes! And thats the point I'm trynna make! We deal with all of the above AND the regular Moe thats talking, texting  or eating while driving!

Nobody said the bikers are always being assholes. But in this case, it's pretty clear they were.

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on October 01, 2013, 05:54:11 PM
Nobody said the bikers are always being assholes. But in this case, it's pretty clear they were.

Quote from: Raza  on October 01, 2013, 03:40:02 PM
And people wouldn't be so quit to blame the bikers if as a group bikers didn't have a history of incidents or near-incidents like this. 

And I've said 50 times that they were wrong in this instance....

The range rover driver is very lucky he made it out alive.   If it were a real motorcycle gang like hells angels he'd be dead or soon be dead because the media shamefully outed his name.

Check this out: 

http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/the-footage-that-the-nyc-bikers-didnt-want-you-to-see-1435594427/1436603736/@orlove (http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/the-footage-that-the-nyc-bikers-didnt-want-you-to-see-1435594427/1436603736/@orlove)

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 05:45:47 PM
And my point is people in cars do the same thing!
Pickup driver tries to kill motorcyclist. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbTZkZTYkaM#)

This one cuts the guy off and after he gives a kick she runs him down! Is deadly force justified here?
Woman driver tries to kill biker (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Papx1GczfFs#)

This one is totally unprovoked!! I've seen shit like this more than once!
Extreme road rage - Car tries to take out bikers! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXPb3nnqdDo#ws)

So in the end it's not always the bikers that are being assholes! And thats the point I'm trynna make! We deal with all of the above AND the regular Moe thats talking, texting  or eating while driving!

For one, many, many, many more people drive a car than ride a motorcycle; as a percentage, the number of drivers aggressive towards bikers is going to be very low compared to riders acting like jackasses.  And I've had people try to sideswipe my car or take me out on more than one occasion, even for something as small as gesturing that I had no place to go when someone wanted to pass me (and then eventually moving over when I had the chance).  But, I also see thousands of motorists daily.  So three or four incidences in the thousands upon thousands of motorists that I've seen is an incredibly small percentage.

And yet, I'd say it's more like half--if not more--of the bikers that I see who ride like jackasses.  Lane-splitting sport bikes, weaving in and out, flying at 30-40mph faster than traffic could turn any driver into a killer if they try to change lanes while the small and hard to see bike is in their blindspot, trying to stand on their bikes while riding on the highway, popping wheelies at 80mph, et al.  Annoying and obnoxious Harley riders revving their engines high for no reason or riding on the shoulder during traffic jams, kicking up gravel at the cars in the right law. 

Based on purely anecdotal evidence, I'd say that bikers are a menace.  I don't though.  I don't automatically assume that a biker is at fault in any altercation.  In this specific case, though, I think it's pretty BLATANTLY obvious what was going on here.  You have to look no further than a mass ride without a permit to see that these riders didn't care at all about what their presence would do to traffic and that they felt entitled to own the road.  Add to that the strength in numbers and relative anonymity of their Power Rangers costumes, you have a large group of bad apples just waiting to spoil someone's day. 

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 06:49:54 PM
And I've said 50 times that they were wrong in this instance....

Whoa, whoa.  I think you're taking devil's advocate way out of context here and the chip on your shoulder is showing, as it has been since you started defending the bikers. 

Quote from: Raza  on October 01, 2013, 09:29:36 PM
Whoa, whoa.  I think you're taking devil's advocate way out of context here and the chip on your shoulder is showing, as it has been since you started defending the bikers. 

From my first post I said I wanted to know what happened AND that the bikers handled it wrong! How many times must I say this?!?! And you other 3 paragraph post shows how you really feel about bikers on a whole and I'd be wasting my time going any further with you! All Bikers are not stunting lane splitting idiots just like all motorist aren't texting, drunk and doing doughnuts in front of the 7 Eleven..........

I would say about half of the bikers I encounter are doing something illegal, reckless or generally threatening to other drivers. I don't have much sympathy for them. They're in the same class as guys who drive monster trucks on public roads and intimidate other drivers.

I can't speak for where y'all live, but it's nowhere near half where I live, and most of the problems are Harleyfags riding slow and being loud maroons. Sport bike riders might be doing stupid things, but all in all, they aren't threatening the safety of drivers. Other riders tend to be fine.

You guys are being awfully hyperbolic.

That said, fuck groups of motorcycles even a fifth that size and ten times as polite. Actually, fuck any large group of stick-together road users, from bicycles to motorcycles to 80 year old cars.

Quote from: S204STi on October 01, 2013, 08:54:27 PM
Check this out: 

http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/the-footage-that-the-nyc-bikers-didnt-want-you-to-see-1435594427/1436603736/@orlove (http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/the-footage-that-the-nyc-bikers-didnt-want-you-to-see-1435594427/1436603736/@orlove)

Yeah. Fuck em all.

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 01, 2013, 09:47:35 PM
From my first post I said I wanted to know what happened AND that the bikers handled it wrong! How many times must I say this?!?! And you other 3 paragraph post shows how you really feel about bikers on a whole and I'd be wasting my time going any further with you! All Bikers are not stunting lane splitting idiots just like all motorist aren't texting, drunk and doing doughnuts in front of the 7 Eleven..........

I never said all.  I said about half of the ones I see.  I have no animosity towards bikers and give them plenty of room when sharing the road with them--sure, it's mostly because I never know when they're about to do something supremely stupid, but it's not like I hold them in the same low regard as I do cyclists. 

My response that you dismiss so handily was metered and reasonable.  I don't know why you think I'm coming across as a frothing at the mouth anti-motorcycle madman. 

Quote from: TurboDan on October 01, 2013, 11:57:48 PM
I would say about half of the bikers I encounter are doing something illegal, reckless or generally threatening to other drivers. I don't have much sympathy for them. They're in the same class as guys who drive monster trucks on public roads and intimidate other drivers.

I've been told, and from my observation it seems to be true, that I-40 through Arkansas is a major bike corridor; lots of activity either as individuals  or groups. A few observations.

When I see a single guy or couple on one Harley type of bike they are almost always following the rules of the road.  When they are in a group they tend to clog the road and ignore the rights of other motorists.  They will ride two abreast in one lane and/or take all available lanes.  They will pass each other at will and casually pull out in front of other drivers if they are present.  It's almost like being in a group us causes them to want to act like jerks.  Peer pressure?  Safety in numbers? A need to impress their buddies on how bad ass they are?

Guys (it's never girls) on crotch rockets, on the other hand, seem to ride like jerks whether they are alone or in a group.  Not all, but a much higher percentage.

It wouldn't hurt my feelings if they slapped severe noise restrictions on motorcycles and rigidly inforced them.  That might save the hearing of many 45 year old accountants out for a bad assed weekend on their mid-life crisis machine.

Two abreast was completely legal last I checked.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 02, 2013, 07:49:09 AM
Two abreast was completely legal last I checked.

I didn't say it's illegal.  And it's not legal everywhere.  Many souces say it's more dangerous than not riding abreast; the argument being if one bike has to swerve to avoid something on the road there is an increased chance of a collision.  How valid is that concern?  Not my call.

Man, there're people who don't wear helmets when they ride. They probably aren't too worried about riding side by side either.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 02, 2013, 08:03:41 AM

I didn't say it's illegal.  And it's not legal everywhere.  Many souces say it's more dangerous than not riding abreast; the argument being if one bike has to swerve to avoid something on the road there is an increased chance of a collision.  How valid is that concern?  Not my call.

I would never ride abreast.  Always staggered in the lane, with a car's length or so between us.

Quote from: Rupert on October 02, 2013, 01:31:39 AM
I can't speak for where y'all live, but it's nowhere near half where I live, and most of the problems are Harleyfags riding slow and being loud maroons. Sport bike riders might be doing stupid things, but all in all, they aren't threatening the safety of drivers. Other riders tend to be fine.

You guys are being awfully hyperbolic.

Yeah, I can say majority of the commuter riders that I've encountered are pretty polite and courteous.  And they typically understand and appreciate when you made a move to let them pass.  Especially since lane splitting is allowed and encouraged in California since it's much worse if you rear end a motorcycle.

And also, majority of the courteous motorcycle riders are in sports bikes.  The asshole riders are typically the ones in Harleys who rides like the own the road and the weekend riders of all kinds that seems to do the same. 

Quote from: NomisR on October 02, 2013, 09:16:57 AM
Yeah, I can say majority of the commuter riders that I've encountered are pretty polite and courteous.  And they typically understand and appreciate when you made a move to let them pass.  Especially since lane splitting is allowed and encouraged in California since it's much worse if you rear end a motorcycle.

And also, majority of the courteous motorcycle riders are in sports bikes.  The asshole riders are typically the ones in Harleys who rides like the own the road and the weekend riders of all kinds that seems to do the same. 

Actually, ive never, ever seen one of those guys on a Eiropean style touring bike do anything assholish. You know, the guys with the hard high mount saddlebags and the high vis vests?

All other types, well there are good and bad riders on all styles.

Page three until the Harley hating? Impressive! Were there any Harleys in that group in the video? On a related note, last night as I was riding home from work, I lane splitted up to a stoplight and there was a blinged out Road King (big Harley) in the fast lane waiting for the light to change. I mean, this dude had $10K in just paint and chrome, with those high ape hanger bars that are totally over the top. So I look over at the dude and nod (super cool HD bro type greeting  :rolleyes:) but no response, so I figure fuck it.
So then the fucking guy starts revving!- and I'm thinking my little Sporty can take that 1000 pound sled easy. The light turns green and I had the dude before the Sporty was in 4th gear! Ha! Not bad for a girl's bike, eh?  :lol:

Yeah bro, that incident really proves your pro-Harley point, doesn't it?

Riding around town, I don't see many stupid biker acts that actually affect me. It's out on the two-lane highways, and it's almost always Harleys. Not all Harleys are in my way, but almost all bikes that are in my way are Harleys.

Quote from: Rupert on October 02, 2013, 11:23:11 AM
Yeah bro, that incident really proves your pro-Harley point, doesn't it?

Riding around town, I don't see many stupid biker acts that actually affect me. It's out on the two-lane highways, and it's almost always Harleys. Not all Harleys are in my way, but almost all bikes that are in my way are Harleys.

We're old and slow. Get off my lawn!  :facepalm:

Seriously, so in Idaho, the Harley riders do under the speed limit? Are you doing the speed limit, or thereabouts?

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 02, 2013, 07:46:58 AM

It wouldn't hurt my feelings if they slapped severe noise restrictions on motorcycles and rigidly inforced them.  That might save the hearing of many 45 year old accountants out for a bad assed weekend on their mid-life crisis machine.

California has passed a noise law. IDK how it effects the Harley guys but Sport Bike Exhaust manufacturers have already started producing exhaust that are noise compliant!

Quote from: S204STi on October 02, 2013, 08:36:13 AM
I would never ride abreast.  Always staggered in the lane, with a car's length or so between us.

This is how we ride also........

Quote from: Raza  on October 02, 2013, 07:11:24 AM
I never said all.  I said about half of the ones I see.  I have no animosity towards bikers and give them plenty of room when sharing the road with them--sure, it's mostly because I never know when they're about to do something supremely stupid, but it's not like I hold them in the same low regard as I do cyclists. 

My response that you dismiss so handily was metered and reasonable.  I don't know why you think I'm coming across as a frothing at the mouth anti-motorcycle madman. 

Well we just have differant views. I've seen just as many idiots on 4 wheels as I have seen on 2 so I call it for what it is.........

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 02, 2013, 01:30:38 PM
Well we just have differant views. I've seen just as many idiots on 4 wheels as I have seen on 2 so I call it for what it is.........

Fair enough.  Agree to disagree.  No hard feelings, I hope.

Also, as I thought about this more, I'm willing to admit there could be a very strong geographical component.  I remember when I was at school, once you got out of town where all the students were riding, as a whole, the riders were pretty responsible.  Philly bikers seem to be a different animal altogether.

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 02, 2013, 01:30:38 PM
California has passed a noise law. IDK how it effects the Harley guys but Sport Bike Exhaust manufacturers have already started producing exhaust that are noise compliant!

Well we just have differant views. I've seen just as many idiots on 4 wheels as I have seen on 2 so I call it for what it is.........

Good, I hope they enforce it.

As to where the majority of real jerks fall, percentage wise  I'd say motorcycles. 

Quote from: shp4man on October 02, 2013, 09:33:58 AM
Page three until the Harley hating? Impressive! Were there any Harleys in that group in the video?

Harley guys/gals act up too!  :lol:
harley crash at deal's (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZFpIpaFMlc#)

Two Harleys Crash - At The Same Time (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aPELDZqUtA#ws)

Fully dressed Harley does 200 yard wheel stand and burnouts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OseU_VGFJIo#)

Quote from: Raza  on October 02, 2013, 01:46:46 PM
Fair enough.  Agree to disagree.  No hard feelings, I hope.

Also, as I thought about this more, I'm willing to admit there could be a very strong geographical component.  I remember when I was at school, once you got out of town where all the students were riding, as a whole, the riders were pretty responsible.  Philly bikers seem to be a different animal altogether.

No hard feelings! And yes I'm sure it depends on what area you're in! A person in NYC or Miami will see more antics than in a smaller or more rural setting.....

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 02, 2013, 01:51:29 PM
Harley guys/gals act up too!  :lol:
harley crash at deal's (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZFpIpaFMlc#)

Two Harleys Crash - At The Same Time (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aPELDZqUtA#ws)

Fully dressed Harley does 200 yard wheel stand and burnouts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OseU_VGFJIo#)

This is what I think of when I think of a group of Harley riders:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/14391 (http://www.hulu.com/watch/14391)


(one of my favorite episodes)

Quote from: Raza  on October 02, 2013, 01:56:05 PM
This is what I think of when I think of a group of Harley riders:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/14391 (http://www.hulu.com/watch/14391)


(one of my favorite episodes)

It's not the HD motorcycles themselves I find amusing, even though until recently they seemed to be more of a product of a blacksmith than a modern factory.  It's the riders and the super serious subscription to the whole HD lifestyle that's amusing.  Every weekend can be halloween when you ride a Harley.   :lol:

The funniest thing is when old Harley guys who are decked out in all the Harley gear pull into a rest stop and they can just barely get off the bike. Yep, that's pretty badass, dude.

Quote from: shp4man on October 02, 2013, 11:28:42 AM
We're old and slow. Get off my lawn!  :facepalm:

Seriously, so in Idaho, the Harley riders do under the speed limit? Are you doing the speed limit, or thereabouts?

Double yep. Not all of them, but when see them ahead of me, I just give up. Often, they don't even want to let you pass anywhere not a passing lane. It's usually the cornering "speed" that is so super slow.

Actually, the FOG doctor types tend to be slow but reasonably courteous. The stupid "lifestyle" guys are the assholes.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 02, 2013, 02:08:45 PM
It's not the HD motorcycles themselves I find amusing, even though until recently they seemed to be more of a product of a blacksmith than a modern factory.  It's the riders and the super serious subscription to the whole HD lifestyle that's amusing.  Every weekend can be halloween when you ride a Harley.   :lol:

:lol:

I get stuck behind harley guys all the time when I'm out driving around. Nothing worse then a nice summer day, a fast car and a twisty road. Until you get stuck behind a couple old guys and their harley's. They go 5-10 under, slow down WAYYYY to much for turns and don't want you to pass.

Bunch of jackasses IMO, nothing worse then coming across one of them.

I don't understand why they drive the "good" roads when all they want to do is go 30 and stare off into the trees.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 02, 2013, 02:08:45 PM
It's not the HD motorcycles themselves I find amusing, even though until recently they seemed to be more of a product of a blacksmith than a modern factory.  It's the riders and the super serious subscription to the whole HD lifestyle that's amusing.  Every weekend can be halloween when you ride a Harley.   :lol:

All right Mr Johnson. We have the anniversary limited custom HD jacket, a HD apparel limited bandana, HD black cotton tee, HD nomad leather bikers pants with extra wide seat, HD limited steel toe chopper extreme boots and of course a pair of HD limited edition and numbered pair of socks. Can I get you anything else?

Do you have any keychains?

Yes we do, official Harley Davidson commemorative Keychains. It's a nice piece, 100% stamped steel with embossed HD logo on the front. These are made in china, but they are only going to make a limited amount of them. It's a great buy and a good investment at only $89.95 a piece.

Wow, I'll take 2!!!!





Sad, but true.

The guy in the RR was 100% wrong. He should have backed up and finished up then roll over a few more. Dude comes at my window like that he'll be removed by the medical examiner.

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 02, 2013, 04:51:27 PM
All right Mr Johnson. We have the anniversary limited custom HD jacket, a HD apparel limited bandana, HD black cotton tee, HD nomad leather bikers pants with extra wide seat, HD limited steel toe chopper extreme boots and of course a pair of HD limited edition and numbered pair of socks. Can I get you anything else?

Do you have any keychains?

Yes we do, official Harley Davidson commemorative Keychains. It's a nice piece, 100% stamped steel with embossed HD logo on the front. These are made in china, but they are only going to make a limited amount of them. It's a great buy and a good investment at only $89.95 a piece.

Wow, I'll take 2!!!!





Sad, but true.

And sadly it's not limited to Harleys.   One of the Mercedes Benz forums I've joined has a sticky poll asking "Why did you buy your car"?  about 50% of the respondents answered with the choice of "Status".  Almost  makes me ashamed I bought one.   

Quote from: Catman on October 02, 2013, 06:03:51 PM
The guy in the RR was 100% wrong. He should have backed up and finished up then roll over a few more. Dude comes at my window like that he'll be removed by the medical examiner.

It really is that simple though, these guys on the bikes are lucky...very lucky. They really don't know how bad things could have turned out. Alot of people have carry permits, granted new york is an exception. However all over the rest of the country there would have been atleast one(the guy smashing the drivers window) if not more that would have gotten a fancy new black sleeping bag after an incident like that.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 02, 2013, 06:04:19 PM
And sadly it's not limited to Harleys.   One of the Mercedes Benz forums I've joined has a sticky poll asking "Why did you buy your car"?  about 50% of the respondents answered with the choice of "Status".  Almost  makes me ashamed I bought one.   

Many high end goods, particularly in the fashion and clothing industry, are little more than about status.  I don't think there's anything particularly wrong with that.  Phaeton failed in large part because VW does not have the necessary status to pull it off.  Lexus has no chance in Europe for many reasons but lack of status is a big one.  When a middle aged guy in an upper middle management position plops down 55 grand for a new E class and drives it to work, he's making a statement.  He wants respect. 

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 02, 2013, 07:02:36 PM
It really is that simple though, these guys on the bikes are lucky...very lucky. They really don't know how bad things could have turned out. Alot of people have carry permits, granted new york is an exception. However all over the rest of the country there would have been atleast one(the guy smashing the drivers window) if not more that would have gotten a fancy new black sleeping bag after an incident like that.

I think the guy in the SUV is more lucky he got out alive.  What's the chance that out of 30 asshat pack mentality motorcyclists, not one of them shot him.  I'm sure some of them were gangbangers that regularly carry. 

Quote from: veeman on October 02, 2013, 07:28:01 PM
I think the guy in the SUV is more lucky he got out alive.  What's the chance that out of 30 asshat pack mentality motorcyclists, not one of them shot him.  I'm sure some of them were gangbangers that regularly carry. 

Well, to be honest. The guy waited alittle longer than he should have before he went into "flee" mode. I would have never let them get me to a complete stop. The act of boxing in and attempting to force my vehicle to a stop is threatening enough.

Quote from: Rupert on October 02, 2013, 01:31:39 AM
I can't speak for where y'all live, but it's nowhere near half where I live, and most of the problems are Harleyfags riding slow and being loud maroons. Sport bike riders might be doing stupid things, but all in all, they aren't threatening the safety of drivers. Other riders tend to be fine.

You guys are being awfully hyperbolic.

Oh man, you gotta see these idiots in Jersey/NYC.  I hope these biker fucks fry.  So many of them around here.

I was speculating with some guys at work about how we would handle this. Eventually we came down to the fact that none of us had ever had much trouble with sport bike riders, but the most annoying thing was groups of cruisers acting like one long vehicle. Frankly, I have little patience for that, and end up having to tuck into groups as I leapfrog them on the highway. If, and It's a big if, they ever decided to get aggressive... Well, good luck keeping up. I'd like to see a fat cruiser stay on my tail on a mountain road.

Quote from: Rupert on October 02, 2013, 11:23:11 AM
Yeah bro, that incident really proves your pro-Harley point, doesn't it?

Riding around town, I don't see many stupid biker acts that actually affect me. It's out on the two-lane highways, and it's almost always Harleys. Not all Harleys are in my way, but almost all bikes that are in my way are Harleys.

Same here. Bikes never seem to cause issues on local streets here. On the highways they are often pure menaces, though.  :huh:

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 02, 2013, 06:04:19 PM
And sadly it's not limited to Harleys.   One of the Mercedes Benz forums I've joined has a sticky poll asking "Why did you buy your car"?  about 50% of the respondents answered with the choice of "Status".  Almost  makes me ashamed I bought one.

I've seen the same type of thread on LR forums. Interestingly, "status" (or something equivalent) was popular on the American forum, but the British/international LR forum responses were much more practical in nature.

I guess that's why we can't have some of the cooler, small engine BMW and MB options.  :devil:

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 02, 2013, 07:52:38 PM
Well, to be honest. The guy waited alittle longer than he should have before he went into "flee" mode. I would have never let them get me to a complete stop. The act of boxing in and attempting to force my vehicle to a stop is threatening enough.

The RR driver also made a fatal error, if we're counting GTA as any blueprint. Ya never get off the highway if you don't have to!  :devil: :lol:

:lol:

Quote from: veeman on October 02, 2013, 07:28:01 PM
I think the guy in the SUV is more lucky he got out alive.  What's the chance that out of 30 asshat pack mentality motorcyclists, not one of them shot him.  I'm sure some of them were gangbangers that regularly carry. 

Most defensive firearm uses really require no more than the gun being drawn for a guy armed with a motorcycle helmet to start rethinking his decisions, and evidence shows that despite anti-gun rhetoric, legal carriers are not going to get in shoot outs with one another over traffic arguments.

Quote from: veeman on October 02, 2013, 07:20:20 PM
Many high end goods, particularly in the fashion and clothing industry, are little more than about status.  I don't think there's anything particularly wrong with that.  Phaeton failed in large part because VW does not have the necessary status to pull it off.  Lexus has no chance in Europe for many reasons but lack of status is a big one.  When a middle aged guy in an upper middle management position plops down 55 grand for a new E class and drives it to work, he's making a statement.  He wants respect.

All too often he is perpetuating the old joke about the difference between a cactus and a Mercedes.   :lol:

You can't buy respect, it must be earned.   And honestly, when you see a total stranger driving a high end car do you automatically respect him?  You may admire the car but I doubt you respect the owner.

When one buys a car (or anything else for that matter) it shouldn't be because of what owning it does for one's image or status.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 03, 2013, 07:33:47 AM
All too often he is perpetuating the old joke about the difference between a cactus and a Mercedes.   :lol:

You can't buy respect, it must be earned.   And honestly, when you see a total stranger driving a high end car do you automatically respect him?  You may admire the car but I doubt you respect the owner.

When one buys a car (or anything else for that matter) it shouldn't be because of what owning it does for one's image or status.

You know that goes on though. We all do.

So any update on what actually created the whole incident? 

This is the best rundown of the whole day that I've seen so far:

http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-terrifying-suv-vs-1440131015 (http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-terrifying-suv-vs-1440131015)

"It looks like the riders, loosely organized around a website called 'Hollywood Stuntz,' were on an annual ride planning to collect in Times Square. At the time they slowed down Lien, they were apparently trying to close the highway... to make room for stunts... ."

Quote from: S204STi on October 03, 2013, 11:19:44 AM
This is the best rundown of the whole day that I've seen so far:

http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-terrifying-suv-vs-1440131015 (http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-terrifying-suv-vs-1440131015)

"It looks like the riders, loosely organized around a website called 'Hollywood Stuntz,' were on an annual ride planning to collect in Times Square. At the time they slowed down Lien, they were apparently trying to close the highway... to make room for stunts... ."

Beyond that, though, the police are instructed not to chase after illegal riders like this, as the Post points out.

It's too easy for these riders to evade the cops by riding on the sidewalk or going against traffic, particularly for the dirt bike riders, and it's therefore dangerous for everyone.

Many of these bikes have no plates at all, and the ones that do often belong on a different bike.


Yeah, sounds like a recipe for a bunch of guys riding responsibly.  Ridiculous.

Quote from: S204STi on October 03, 2013, 11:19:44 AM
This is the best rundown of the whole day that I've seen so far:

http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-terrifying-suv-vs-1440131015 (http://jalopnik.com/everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-terrifying-suv-vs-1440131015)

"It looks like the riders, loosely organized around a website called 'Hollywood Stuntz,' were on an annual ride planning to collect in Times Square. At the time they slowed down Lien, they were apparently trying to close the highway... to make room for stunts... ."

Their advice at the end though is trash.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 03, 2013, 11:55:17 AM
Their advice at the end though is trash.

Well, it's obviously the guy's fault for not pulling over..

But then again, considering he's asian, he probably doesn't know how to drive properly so he didn't know what to do... :huh:

Quote from: NomisR on October 03, 2013, 12:41:47 PM
Well, it's obviously the guy's fault for not pulling over..

But then again, considering he's asian, he probably doesn't know how to drive properly so he didn't know what to do... :huh:

I missed that part where you're supposed to clear the road for bikers who want to do stunts.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 03, 2013, 07:33:47 AM
All too often he is perpetuating the old joke about the difference between a cactus and a Mercedes.   :lol:

You can't buy respect, it must be earned.   And honestly, when you see a total stranger driving a high end car do you automatically respect him?  You may admire the car but I doubt you respect the owner.

When one buys a car (or anything else for that matter) it shouldn't be because of what owning it does for one's image or status.

i agree with a lot of this in principal.  in reality it's not how the vast majority of people are.  it's all shades of grey of course.

some (many) people buy a merc not to get respect from strangers but to get respect from their peers be it their other extended family, neighbors, or coworkers.  you buy something expensive, people you know see it and comment on its attractiveness, and it makes you feel good about yourself.  that's human nature.  nothing wrong with that.

that's the whole economy of high end fashion, which luxury cars are largely about.  someone buying a high end mercedes strictly based upon its driving or comfort or style or safety characteristics and not at least in small or large part because "it's a mercedes" would be a rare occurrence.  that is why lexus, acura, and infiniti were created.  too differentiate from the more plebian toyota, honda, and nissan.   

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 03, 2013, 12:44:20 PM
I missed that part where you're supposed to clear the road for bikers who want to do stunts.

Well, that's the advice that was given saying the driver made the wrong move by not doing so which put himself and his family in danger...

Quote from: NomisR on October 03, 2013, 01:06:10 PM
Well, that's the advice that was given saying the driver made the wrong move by not doing so which put himself and his family in danger...

They said move over and call the police.  It's the safe move, generally. 

Quote from: Raza  on October 03, 2013, 01:25:56 PM
They said move over and call the police.  It's the safe move, generally. 

How do you pull over when you're surrounded?

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 03, 2013, 01:29:20 PM
How do you pull over when you're surrounded?

Run over the biker next to you?  [/quote]

Well, someone at work said the guy should've waited and let the gang of 300 bikers through before pulling into the highway....  yeah good idea...

Who says they just surround everyone and expect them to, like, osmosify through them to the shoulder? I bet if the RR had done what they wanted it to do, this wouldn't have happened. Which is not to say that what they wanted it to do was at all reasonable.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 03, 2013, 01:29:20 PM
How do you pull over when you're surrounded?

I suppose "Call the police and then attempt to move over" would be better advice.

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 01:32:53 PM
Who says they just surround everyone and expect them to, like, osmosify through them to the shoulder? I bet if the RR had done what they wanted it to do, this wouldn't have happened. Which is not to say that what they wanted it to do was at all reasonable.

Ok. So a group of unknown people surround you and direct you to get off the freeway. What do you assume is going to happen next?

Quote from: Raza  on October 03, 2013, 01:25:56 PM
They said move over and call the police.  It's the safe move, generally. 

It's the same advice given in any road rage situation, really.  This is just mildly different.

Quote from: S204STi on October 03, 2013, 01:56:03 PM
It's the same advice given in any road rage situation, really.  This is just mildly different.

I hear road rage, I think of two overweight bald guys getting into an argument about which one forgot to signal. This isn't that, it's more of an attempted road takeover.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 03, 2013, 02:00:10 PM

I hear road rage, I think of two overweight bald guys getting into an argument about which one forgot to signal. This isn't that, it's more of an attempted road takeover.

Sure, I'm just saying... he didn't deserve his shit getting fucked up, but there was a way to avoid the whole thing.  That's all I'm insinuating.

Quote from: S204STi on October 03, 2013, 02:12:29 PM
Sure, I'm just saying... he didn't deserve his shit getting fucked up, but there was a way to avoid the whole thing.  That's all I'm insinuating.

Our founding fathers could have avoided war by just laying down for the British, but they didn't.  :erjerbs:

Quote from: veeman on October 03, 2013, 01:03:22 PM

some (many) people buy a merc not to get respect from strangers but to get respect from their peers be it their other extended family, neighbors, or coworkers.  you buy something expensive, people you know see it and comment on its attractiveness, and it makes you feel good about yourself.  that's human nature.  nothing wrong with that.

Frankly it's a bit pathetic that someone would need that kind of praise to make them feel good about themselves.  And how would your perception of someone you already know change just becasue they bought a "luxury" car.  (I put luxury in quotes because I firmly believe that if you are driving it yourself it isn't luxury, it's just a nice car.)

Quote from: veeman on October 03, 2013, 01:03:22 PM

that's the whole economy of high end fashion, which luxury cars are largely about.  someone buying a high end mercedes strictly based upon its driving or comfort or style or safety characteristics and not at least in small or large part because "it's a mercedes" would be a rare occurrence.  that is why lexus, acura, and infiniti were created.  too differentiate from the more plebian toyota, honda, and nissan.

I guess I'm the rare occurance then.  I absolutely despise buying or wearing anything thought of as 'designer'.   If anybody expects me to wear something with a designer logo on it they better be prepared to pay me for helping them advertise their product.

You should have seen people's reactions when I told them I bought a Porsche before I told them how old and cheap it was. I suddenly changed into some kind of ego-lawyer-monster in their eyes for a moment. Hilarious.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 03, 2013, 01:51:39 PM
Ok. So a group of unknown people surround you and direct you to get off the freeway. What do you assume is going to happen next?

Given that everyone else was moving over and then the bikers went harmlessly past them, that. If it were a rural road with no one else on it, fuck no, I'd haul ass and call the cops.

I don't think it's wrong for the RR to have not pulled to the side and let the bikers do whatever they wanted with the road, but that's not the safest option.

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 03:11:23 PM
Given that everyone else was moving over and then the bikers went harmlessly past them, that. If it were a rural road with no one else on it, fuck no, I'd haul ass and call the cops.

I don't think it's wrong for the RR to have not pulled to the side and let the bikers do whatever they wanted with the road, but that's not the safest option.

Maybe a bumper sticker would help.   Something like: "My other weapon is a Glock".

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 03:11:23 PM
Given that everyone else was moving over and then the bikers went harmlessly past them, that. If it were a rural road with no one else on it, fuck no, I'd haul ass and call the cops.

I don't think it's wrong for the RR to have not pulled to the side and let the bikers do whatever they wanted with the road, but that's not the safest option.

Getting on a freeway, do you have time to assess what everybody else is doing and how it's turning out for them? I don't see any cops around, not for many mile apparently; and last I checked, crime does happen in NYC.

Yes, you do.

What the fuck are these assholes doing-- oh, everyone is moving to the side.

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 03:34:34 PM
Yes, you do.

What the fuck are these assholes doing-- oh, everyone is moving to the side.

Yes when you have no idea what's going on, it's always safe to just go with the crowd.

Come on. Once you see that people are moving to the side, it's pretty easy to also see that they're not being assaulted or robbed or whatever. It's not like once you've moved over you wouldn't be able to leave the side of the road.

It's like how you don't fault someone for fighting a mugger, even if the safest option is usually to just give them your wallet.

This isn't like an instant thing, Soup. You have a minute or so to figure out what-the-fuck and decide what to do.

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 03:34:34 PM
Yes, you do.

What the fuck are these assholes doing-- oh, everyone is moving to the side.

You can't assume that.  They may have done so earlier but maybe where he was at, he didn't get to see them.  Anything could've happened. 

RR driver isn't in the wrong for not moving, but clearly the bikers are doing something illegal if they were blockading the road and preventing other people from getting on the highway.  200 complaints about their activities isn't insignificant.

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 04:19:45 PM
This isn't like an instant thing, Soup. You have a minute or so to figure out what-the-fuck and decide what to do.

It takes you a minute or so to get on the freeway?

\_

This is the angle you are being. Stop it.

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 10:29:50 PM
\_

This is the angle you are being. Stop it.

No.

I see a bunch of punks forcing people off the road, I'm not going to assume they're harmless. I'm going to try to get out of that situation pronto.

Plus, I'm not going to blame some dude for not immediately recognizing an odd situation like that.

Quote from: Rupert on October 03, 2013, 03:34:34 PM
Yes, you do.

What the fuck are these assholes doing-- oh, everyone is moving to the side.

Some entrance ramps, especially on older urban freeways, are pretty damn short. Once you are on them there are few options other than accelerate and merge and hope for the best.

His wife called the police during the initial confrontation. While on the phone, the bikers were beating the sides of his car with their helmets, slashing his tires (which is why his escape failed), and attempting to pry open his doors.

Dude had a small child in the car, I would have run over as many of those fuckers as possible and not thought twice.

Quote from: Tave on October 04, 2013, 06:45:52 AM
His wife called the police during the initial confrontation. While on the phone, the bikers were beating the sides of his car with their helmets, slashing his tires (which is why his escape failed), and attempting to pry open his doors.

Dude had a small child in the car, I would have run over as many of those fuckers as possible and not thought twice.

+1

Quote from: CALL_911 on October 05, 2013, 02:15:32 PM
+1

Nothing could be further from the truth.

What a horrible thing, and to think I come here and see most people defending this psychotic maniac.

This was just a bunch of bikers out for a casual sunday ride, on their way to an orphanage to help brighten the day of needy children. After a brief layover at a hospital where they bathed and fed premature babies. These guys hopped on their bikes and decided to get some fresh air on their way to the orphanage.

As they drove down the freeway they where confronted by satan himself, dispensing death and chaos is his sole means of existence. With his demon bride and demonic spawn in tow. They terrorized and maimed the righteous disciples of love and compassion. Laughing manically as bones crunched and souls screamed. His demonic witch gyrating in pleasure as the darkness drapes over the land. Crunching and screaming as gasoline pumped into his mechanical death chariot.

Just when it seemed the chaos couldn't possible be worse, he hurls his satanic spawn at the leader of gods faithful riders. Attempting to block the demon with his bible, to no avail. The tiny arms slashing and scrapping at the mans eyes and face. Finally, with one fatal blow the jugular is severed, and the noble rider falls to the asphalt.

This played out for mere minutes, yet would mark these poor souls for the rest of their lives.

What a tragedy.

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 05, 2013, 07:50:45 PM
Nothing could be further from the truth.

What a horrible thing, and to think I come here and see most people defending this psychotic maniac.

This was just a bunch of bikers out for a casual sunday ride, on their way to an orphanage to help brighten the day of needy children. After a brief layover at a hospital where they bathed and fed premature babies. These guys hopped on their bikes and decided to get some fresh air on their way to the orphanage.

As they drove down the freeway they where confronted by satan himself, dispensing death and chaos is his sole means of existence. With his demon bride and demonic spawn in tow. They terrorized and maimed the righteous disciples of love and compassion. Laughing manically as bones crunched and souls screamed. His demonic witch gyrating in pleasure as the darkness drapes over the land. Crunching and screaming as gasoline pumped into his mechanical death chariot.

Just when it seemed the chaos couldn't possible be worse, he hurls his satanic spawn at the leader of gods faithful riders. Attempting to block the demon with his bible, to no avail. The tiny arms slashing and scrapping at the mans eyes and face. Finally, with one fatal blow the jugular is severed, and the noble rider falls to the asphalt.

This played out for mere minutes, yet would mark these poor souls for the rest of their lives.

What a tragedy.

I know now that my drugs aren't as good as yours. 

The dude who was on camera breaking the window with his helmet turned himself in:

http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news/local/new_york&id=9274018 (http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news/local/new_york&id=9274018)

Quote from: Raza  on October 05, 2013, 11:06:50 PM
I know now that my drugs aren't as good as yours. 

I make my own, it's all right here in this pamphlet.

"Earlier, Eyewitness News learned that among the bikers on the Henry Hudson last weekend, were five off-duty NYPD officers.

Sources say at least two detectives witnessed the attack on Alexian Lien and did not directly intervene. And investigators are still working to determine what role, if any, was played by the other three officers.

What is clear, sources say, is that the men did not begin to come forward until late Wednesday, four full-days after the incident.

And detectives are also investigating reports that several others in the group may have been off-duty New York City correction officers.

An undercover detective has informed Internal Affairs that he was present at the time of the confrontation.

The undercover narcotics detective, himself a motorcycle rider, was off duty. Official sources say he did not get involved because he did not want to blow his cover. Internal Affairs is now investigating. The undercover detective is being advised by an attorney.
"

And the shit gets deeper and deeper.

Title of this thread is looking kind of strange now, aint it?

Yeah the OP failed at life.

Not surprising, cops are people too.

They are used to gang tactics, mob mentality, un-necessary physical violence and self preservation when in the uniform. It's only natural to assume this is the way they are.

Narcotics = victimless crime < people actually getting hurt

So now the driver of the range rover can sue the police department. That's good news, since I'm sure the riders that actually attacked him don't have any money to speak of. Certainly they won't have pockets anywhere near the depth of the local PD.

You could sue them for a Muzzy exhaust for an SV650. That should be worth something.

Quote from: 280Z Turbo on October 05, 2013, 11:42:40 PM
You could sue them for a Muzzy exhaust for an SV650. That should be worth something.

Are they worth anything with tire marks all over them?

Quote from: 280Z Turbo on October 05, 2013, 11:35:51 PM
Narcotics = victimless crime < people actually getting hurt

I really doubt that if the undercover guys there were really working a case that we would have ever heard about any of it, much less an internal affairs case opened on it.

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 05, 2013, 11:33:26 PM
Not surprising, cops are people too.

They are used to gang tactics, mob mentality, un-necessary physical violence and self preservation when in the uniform. It's only natural to assume this is the way they are.

Cops are not people.  If you start thinking of them that way, you play right into their game. 

huh!!!

http://news.yahoo.com/video/video-surfaces-bikers-attacking-another-131013149.html (http://news.yahoo.com/video/video-surfaces-bikers-attacking-another-131013149.html)

Trash, all of them.

I hope they keep this shit up, it's only a matter of time before they end up picking on someone who isn't weak or scared of their "safety in numbers" mentality.

Or they beat on a South African spec car with flame throwers...

Actually I'm glad the public in general is seeing the hooliganism for what it is

That's all bad..........

Shitheads.

what's good about the recent happenings is that you're not going to see this, what another poster has aptly called a rolling shit show, any time again in the near future in manhattan.

i'm sure the police brass is getting hell for not being more proactive and the city is embarrassed.  i bet the next time two guys are riding sport bikes within a few feet of each other in manhattan they are going to be stopped with tickets/summons for something like violating a noise ordinance or riding 5 mph above the speed limit. 

if this happened on the south side of chicago, no one would care.  because it happened to a wall street type guy and his family on the henry hudson parkway, they're going to be consequences.

This became big news because one the riders captured the whole thing on video and posted it to YouTube for everyone to see, not because the victim was a Wall Street type.

Quote from: veeman on October 08, 2013, 09:21:42 AM
what's good about the recent happenings is that you're not going to see this, what another poster has aptly called a rolling shit show, any time again in the near future in manhattan.

i'm sure the police brass is getting hell for not being more proactive and the city is embarrassed.  i bet the next time two guys are riding sport bikes within a few feet of each other in manhattan they are going to be stopped with tickets/summons for something like violating a noise ordinance or riding 5 mph above the speed limit. 

if this happened on the south side of chicago, no one would care.  because it happened to a wall street type guy and his family on the henry hudson parkway, they're going to be consequences.

So in chicago people run over bikers all the time?

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 08, 2013, 10:12:42 AM
So in chicago people run over bikers all the time?

South side is like the wild west.

Quote from: Raza  on October 08, 2013, 10:46:58 AM
South side is like the wild west.

ahh, I see. I was unaware of that. All my boys are from the east side so I don't know what happens in other areas of chi town.

Quote from: veeman on October 08, 2013, 09:21:42 AM
what's good about the recent happenings is that you're not going to see this, what another poster has aptly called a rolling shit show, any time again in the near future in manhattan.

i'm sure the police brass is getting hell for not being more proactive and the city is embarrassed.  i bet the next time two guys are riding sport bikes within a few feet of each other in manhattan they are going to be stopped with tickets/summons for something like violating a noise ordinance or riding 5 mph above the speed limit. 

if this happened on the south side of chicago, no one would care.  because it happened to a wall street type guy and his family on the henry hudson parkway, they're going to be consequences.

What does anybody know about Mr. lien anyways? Besides he drives a Range Rover, I mean. Which is really; big fucking deal. Lots of people buy things they can't afford. That in itself doesn't mean he's wealthy.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 08, 2013, 12:54:25 PM
What does anybody know about Mr. lien anyways? Besides he drives a Range Rover, I mean. Which is really; big fucking deal. Lots of people buy things they can't afford. That in itself doesn't mean he's wealthy.

Another thing, about society and cars in general.

Why is it that the guy who paid 40-45K for a new 3 series is "rich" or "well off" and the guy who pays 50-60K for a loaded half ton truck "just a normal guy".

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 08, 2013, 12:57:13 PM
Another thing, about society and cars in general.

Why is it that the guy who paid 40-45K for a new 3 series is "rich" or "well off" and the guy who pays 50-60K for a loaded half ton truck "just a normal guy".

Yeah.. people still thinks my Lotus costs way more than it did.. :huh:

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 08, 2013, 12:57:13 PM
Another thing, about society and cars in general.

Why is it that the guy who paid 40-45K for a new 3 series is "rich" or "well off" and the guy who pays 50-60K for a loaded half ton truck "just a normal guy".

Because rednecks don't get rich, they just get bigger dicks.

Quote from: MX793 on October 08, 2013, 10:10:25 AM
This became big news because one the riders captured the whole thing on video and posted it to YouTube for everyone to see, not because the victim was a Wall Street type.

Heh, but the reaction on this board would have been waaaay different of the RR had been a rusty 1985 LTD. :lol:

Quote from: Rupert on October 08, 2013, 01:53:42 PM
Heh, but the reaction on this board would have been waaaay different of the RR had been a rusty 1985 LTD. :lol:

Not mine, I still would have sided with wimmer's decision to run down the motorcycle guys.

Quote from: Rupert on October 08, 2013, 01:53:42 PM
Heh, but the reaction on this board would have been waaaay different of the RR had been a rusty 1985 LTD. :lol:

Well, this would be poor people vs poor people in your scenario, so there shouldn't be any bias from the Spinners in that case.  Now if it was a 1985 LTD running over bunch of rich guys.. that's another scenario..

Turns out the guy bashing on a rear window with his helmet is an undercover cop and now he is being charged.   Dirtbags in uniform. :nutty:

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 09, 2013, 09:02:10 AM
Turns out the guy bashing on a rear window with his helmet is an undercover cop and now he is being charged.   Dirtbags in uniform. :nutty:

There is alot of them out there, I hope this guy gets the book thrown at him. Loose his job, barred from future law enforcement positions and of course jail time.

Sheesh, so there's what?  at least 3 or 4 officers involved in this?  I'm still surprised there isn't as much coverage on this as with the whole Zimmerman case, it has like 1/100th the coverage if that..

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 09, 2013, 09:02:10 AM
Turns out the guy bashing on a rear window with his helmet is an undercover cop and now he is being charged.   Dirtbags in uniform. :nutty:

He was trying not to blow his cover....

Was he actually undercover or was he just off-duty?

Quote from: MX793 on October 09, 2013, 03:52:37 PM
He was trying not to blow his cover....

Was he actually undercover or was he just off-duty?

I watched kingpin the other day.

This reminds me of the scene where roy(woody) went over and punched the amish guy(forget his name) for dancing with the guys girlfriend.

Later in the car he mentioned he was just doing it to save ishmel(i think that's his name). To which the response was

"buy you didn't have to have drinks with them afterward"


Sums up this undercover cop. "I didn't want to blow my cover" "Well you didn't have to jump right in there and start bashing the window out".

Just a bunch of excuses from a pathetic example of a police officer, hopefully former police officer.

Quote from: NomisR on October 09, 2013, 03:26:46 PM
Sheesh, so there's what?  at least 3 or 4 officers involved in this?  I'm still surprised there isn't as much coverage on this as with the whole Zimmerman case, it has like 1/100th the coverage if that..

One wonders why Bloomberg, who feels like commenting on everything everywhere hasnt said squat about this.

Then again, he rides around with an armed security detail, so it's not really something he needs to worry about, is it?

I did wonder, after viewing some of the videos on jalopnik, that these bikers seemed to know how to control an intersection. You see lead guys systematically blocking cars and letting the rest pass. It was clearly something they had done before and it looks like a police maneuver to me.

I just wonder if some of the cops that were in this thing had a hand in showing them how.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on October 09, 2013, 05:18:00 PM
One wonders why Bloomberg, who feels like commenting on everything everywhere hasnt said squat about this.

Then again, he rides around with an armed security detail, so it's not really something he needs to worry about, is it?

Maybe he was one of the riders... :lol:

Quote from: NomisR on October 09, 2013, 03:26:46 PM
Sheesh, so there's what?  at least 3 or 4 officers involved in this?  I'm still surprised there isn't as much coverage on this as with the whole Zimmerman case, it has like 1/100th the coverage if that..

Maybe because no one was killed.........

Quote from: Gotta-Qik-G8 on October 09, 2013, 06:05:13 PM
  Maybe because no one was killed.........

It's a disgrace, embarassing to the city and even moreso when their "own" people who are supposed to uphold the law and protect people where not only present, but involved on the front lines.

He's keeping his mouth shut because there is nothing to say.

Quote from: MX793 on October 09, 2013, 03:52:37 PM
He was trying not to blow his cover....

Was he actually undercover or was he just off-duty?

There were a couple dozen scum bags around the SUV and only 2 or three were actively beating on the SUV (at least in the video I saw).  He could have been one of the ones not doing that and maintained his cover.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 09, 2013, 08:24:20 PM
There were a couple dozen scum bags around the SUV and only 2 or three were actively beating on the SUV (at least in the video I saw).  He could have been one of the ones not doing that and maintained his cover.

Well one of the supposed undercover cops was one of the ones caught on video for beating and kicking the SUV.

And wasn't there a NYPD internal affairs guy that was there for the ride, even though he wasn't officially on that case at the time. 

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2013/10/09/undercover-detective-charged-in-motorcycle-suv-melee-due-in-court/ (http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2013/10/09/undercover-detective-charged-in-motorcycle-suv-melee-due-in-court/)

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 09, 2013, 06:42:37 PM
It's a disgrace, embarassing to the city and even moreso when their "own" people who are supposed to uphold the law and protect people where not only present, but involved on the front lines.

He's keeping his mouth shut because there is nothing to say.

Never stopped him before.

Quote from: FlatBlackCaddy on October 09, 2013, 03:59:31 PM
I watched kingpin the other day.

This reminds me of the scene where roy(woody) went over and punched the amish guy(forget his name) for dancing with the guys girlfriend.

Later in the car he mentioned he was just doing it to save ishmel(i think that's his name). To which the response was

"buy you didn't have to have drinks with them afterward"


Sums up this undercover cop. "I didn't want to blow my cover" "Well you didn't have to jump right in there and start bashing the window out".

Just a bunch of excuses from a pathetic example of a police officer, hopefully former police officer.

Quote from: MiataJohn on October 09, 2013, 08:24:20 PM
There were a couple dozen scum bags around the SUV and only 2 or three were actively beating on the SUV (at least in the video I saw).  He could have been one of the ones not doing that and maintained his cover.

Sarcasm, guys.

Quote from: NomisR on October 09, 2013, 03:26:46 PM
Sheesh, so there's what?  at least 3 or 4 officers involved in this?  I'm still surprised there isn't as much coverage on this as with the whole Zimmerman case, it has like 1/100th the coverage if that..

There's only so much sensory overload the collective zeitgeist can take before it needs to hibernate and recharge its batteries.

Plus as shitty as this is this is hardly the worst of what is going on in NYC right now, especially concerning the NYPD. But nobody cares about those victims

Quote from: 12,000 RPM on October 14, 2013, 09:02:57 AM
Plus as shitty as this is this is hardly the worst of what is going on in NYC right now, especially concerning the NYPD. But nobody cares about those victims

Correct.