Quote from: MrH on August 05, 2022, 09:55:13 AM


Tesla has crashed and killed people on autopilot multiple times and you don't seem to care.

So the above should have received at least equal global outrage to the typical "omfg Tesla killed someone" outrage... Correct?

If it was a Tesla on autopilot people would be screaming it shouldn't be allowed on the roads.  But it was an person driving so it's just a giant shrug.

One is a company selling a product that's marketed as driving itself, killing people.  The other is an individual driving that way. Those are very different things.

We don't know what caused this accident.  If it was intentional and the driver lived, they would get charged with murder/manslaughter.  Tesla gets a pass...why?

How fast was the guy going?  Seems almost like a blur crashing through the intersection.

That guy was clearly speeding intentionally. It wasn't driver error, it wasn't a mistake.

Unless the autonomous system prevents manual control at all, it would not have prevented an intentional act like this.

Quote from: Soup DeVille on August 05, 2022, 11:30:32 AM
That guy was clearly speeding intentionally. It wasn't driver error, it wasn't a mistake.

Unless the autonomous system prevents manual control at all, it would not have prevented an intentional act like this.

Maybe it was a Toyota with the throttle stuck wide open...because of spaghetti code, or floor mats.

Quote from: MrH on August 05, 2022, 10:02:25 AM
One is a company selling a product that's marketed as driving itself, killing people.  The other is an individual driving that way. Those are very different things.

We don't know what caused this accident.  If it was intentional and the driver lived, they would get charged with murder/manslaughter.  Tesla gets a pass...why?

The end result is a deadly auto accident.  No difference there.


Tesla isn't treated any different then any other automaker or for that matter a gun manufacturer then?  No criminal charges, slight possibility of civil lawsuit?

Gun manufacturers aren't making any claims about not firing at people.  Tesla does.

My 2015 Subaru would've stopped.

Quote from: Laconian on August 05, 2022, 11:50:21 AM
My 2015 Subaru would've stopped.

FSD would have stopped her. FSD in the victims' cars would have afforded them some chance: evasion/braking/pre-collision airbag deployment, something.

Theoretically perfect FSD for the victim's car, perhaps. I don't think the Tesla webcam sensor suite would be able to resolve an impending T-bone at those speeds.

Quote from: Laconian on August 05, 2022, 12:54:57 PM
Theoretically perfect FSD for the victim's car, perhaps. I don't think the Tesla webcam sensor suite would be able to resolve an impending T-bone at those speeds.

So....something fictional would have saved people

Quote from: Laconian on August 05, 2022, 12:54:57 PM
Theoretically perfect FSD for the victim's car, perhaps. I don't think the Tesla webcam sensor suite would be able to resolve an impending T-bone at those speeds.

I'd take imperfect over zero. They'd react quicker than people can and see 360°.

Quote from: r0tor on August 05, 2022, 09:39:46 AM

This shit happens every day and it's accepted.  If a Tesla did that on autopilot the world would erupt in outrage.

Which the world should - ten years hence with billions of $$$$ spent and millions of miles driven and millions of gallons of fuel burned and ALL autonomous driving still don't work the same, whereas only a fraction of a fraction of drivers are equivalently defective. Plus, That was effectively intentional which autonomous driving won't probably stop.

Quote from: Morris Minor on August 05, 2022, 01:41:44 PM
I'd take imperfect over zero. They'd react quicker than people can and see 360°.

What really would've stopped that collision would be a roundabout instead of a red light.

Or better urban planning and functioning mass transit.

Quote from: Laconian on August 05, 2022, 03:27:34 PM
What really would've stopped that collision would be a roundabout instead of a red light.

Or better urban planning and functioning mass transit.

YES PLEASE, esp. with the USA's pervasive urban homelessness, poverty and crime:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7kor5nHtZQ

When you build shitty cities that the regular folk want to flee at 5pm, then of course you get Mad Max urban centers.

Quote from: Laconian on August 05, 2022, 05:22:49 PM
When you build shitty cities that the regular folk want to flee at 5pm, then of course you get Mad Max urban centers.

I don't understand why people can't just live in a small town and have no commute, like I do.

Quote from: Eye of the Tiger on August 05, 2022, 05:24:46 PM
I don't understand why people can't just live in a small town and have no commute, like I do.

"The energy, maaaaaaan."

Quote from: Laconian on August 05, 2022, 03:27:34 PM
What really would've stopped that collision would be a roundabout instead of a red light.

Or better urban planning and functioning mass transit.

THIS!!! When people ask me what I miss about the UK, I always tell them roundabouts and "Give Way" (Yield) signs.
Here we fetishize red lights and stop signs. 😀

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLJb-qd9fzk

LOL

Quote from: FoMoJo on August 06, 2022, 05:41:20 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLJb-qd9fzk

No collision avoidance system.

Quote from: FoMoJo on August 06, 2022, 05:41:20 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLJb-qd9fzk

They were easily doing double the speed limit. Maybe don't build a ramping slope though....

Quote from: Morris Minor on August 05, 2022, 06:05:24 AM
Why we need autonomous systems:
https://youtu.be/rxI9ujNQNBA

MSM says the driver is a nurse, a 37-year-old woman from Texas & was doing 100 mph. Should be easy to measure that frame-by-frame from the video.

Quote from: Morris Minor on August 07, 2022, 06:05:41 AM
MSM says the driver is a nurse, a 37-year-old woman from Texas & was doing 100 mph. Should be easy to measure that frame-by-frame from the video.

Deliberate or a vehicle malfunction?  I would hope the latter, as horrible as the incident was.

Quote from: Laconian on August 05, 2022, 05:22:49 PM
When you build shitty cities that the regular folk want to flee at 5pm, then of course you get Mad Max urban centers.

It's the people, not the cities. Any city - any living area - is fine if the people are fine.

You'll only have Japanese-level mass transit effectiveness and urban planning (i.e., the best in the world by like a factor of 10 at least) with an iron fist, particularly that illicit drugs, homelessness and petty crime are treated as serious offenses (i.e. you get locked up and shipped out), and whereby fathereless homes and unemployment are more than frowned upon by the culture.

USA is obviously going in the opposite direction, and it will never recover (at least in our lifetimes).

The zoning laws matter a lot too. I thought I shared this video a while ago but I don't see it in my post history.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfm2xCKOCNk

Quote from: FoMoJo on August 07, 2022, 08:41:01 AM
Deliberate or a vehicle malfunction?  I would hope the latter, as horrible as the incident was.

Vehicle malfunction is almost never the cause of crashes. It's pretty well always the driver. I'm sure all will be revealed in due course.

Quote from: Morris Minor on August 06, 2022, 05:27:19 AM
THIS!!! When people ask me what I miss about the UK, I always tell them roundabouts and "Give Way" (Yield) signs.
Here we fetishize red lights and stop signs. 😀

They've been putting in more and more roundabouts around here. Has helped a lot in keeping the highway traffic moving at busy intersections that were previously very congested and/or dangerous with normal stoplights.

Quote from: CaminoRacer on August 07, 2022, 11:10:33 AM
The zoning laws matter a lot too. I thought I shared this video a while ago but I don't see it in my post history.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfm2xCKOCNk

Didn't watch the whole video- but my South Carolina community is a sleepy southern town across the river from the 3rd largest city in Georgia. But the dummies here are looking at allowing exemptions to all kinds of zoning laws for new subdivisions- smaller lots, less space away from the street, buildings closer to each other, denser families in both single family and townhouse zones.....