Porsche Macan

[r0tor]

they should drop the porsche cayanne and keep the porsche cayanne S as its base model.  i hardly ever see base porsche cayannes and it's not nearly fast enough to be a porsche today. 

its silly when car and driver or whomever tests these vehicles offroad.  they're not meant to offroad in.  They're meant for all weather driving on paved roads.  range rover i can understand because there are some people who offroad in them. 

There are plenty of tests between the cayanne and range rover that suggest the rover offroad advantage is minimal if any

[SVT_Power]

I don't know about the current gen Cayenne, but everything I've heard/read said the first gen Cayenne was actually quite capable offroad

[Rupert]

It's relative.

[Soup DeVille]

I don't know about the current gen Cayenne, but everything I've heard/read said the first gen Cayenne was actually quite capable offroad

It might be. His point was that nobody is buying it for that.
He might be right, but it is a point that they sometimes sell it on.

[Galaxy]

I don't know about the current gen Cayenne, but everything I've heard/read said the first gen Cayenne was actually quite capable offroad

Cayenne1/Touareg1 had mechanical differential locks, a transfer case, decouplable stabilizers (or whatever the english term is) and things like approach/depproach angles, fording depth were a consideration during the design. This was the height of the Piëch era which also included projects like the Phaeton, and the Bugatti Veyron. After he stepped down as CEO the dark ages started, which included things like "new" Golfs, and Passats being simple facelifts of old models. To be fair they did improve reliability. I am somewhat hopeful that with the Piëch/Porsche clan now having a controlling stake in VW AG, and less then 10% of shares being publicly traded, that the company will again be run as a hobby.

Ironically Touareg2 can be ordered with the suspension of Touareg1, but only in Europe, not the USA where much more people go offroading. 

[12,000 RPM]

I thought the new Golf was a complete rework? Lost 200lbs.

And with chassis' being as developed as they are, the "big facelift" thing makes sense. Find more rigidity through better metallurgy and tweaks, change the appearance. No point in reinventing the wheel if the one you have now is round enough.

[Galaxy]

I thought the new Golf was a complete rework? Lost 200lbs.

And with chassis' being as developed as they are, the "big facelift" thing makes sense. Find more rigidity through better metallurgy and tweaks, change the appearance. No point in reinventing the wheel if the one you have now is round enough.

I was talking about Golf V to VI. Golf VII is entirely new.

[Raza]

they should drop the porsche cayanne and keep the porsche cayanne S as its base model.  i hardly ever see base porsche cayannes and it's not nearly fast enough to be a porsche today. 

its silly when car and driver or whomever tests these vehicles offroad.  they're not meant to offroad in.  They're meant for all weather driving on paved roads.  range rover i can understand because there are some people who offroad in them.

Might as well not test supercars for performance either, since most people who buy them drive them very slowly.

[12,000 RPM]

I was talking about Golf V to VI. Golf VII is entirely new.

So it's not really the dark ages (not trying to be snarky here).

[Madman]

I was talking about Golf V to VI. Golf VII is entirely new.

And the B7 Passat the rest of the world gets (NOT the North American NMS Passat) is really a reworked B6.

[Soup DeVille]

Cayenne1/Touareg1 had mechanical differential locks, a transfer case, decouplable stabilizers (or whatever the english term is) and things like approach/depproach angles, fording depth were a consideration during the design. This was the height of the Piëch era which also included projects like the Phaeton, and the Bugatti Veyron. After he stepped down as CEO the dark ages started, which included things like "new" Golfs, and Passats being simple facelifts of old models. To be fair they did improve reliability. I am somewhat hopeful that with the Piëch/Porsche clan now having a controlling stake in VW AG, and less then 10% of shares being publicly traded, that the company will again be run as a hobby.

Ironically Touareg2 can be ordered with the suspension of Touareg1, but only in Europe, not the USA where much more people go offroading. 

Sway bar disconnects would be the English term.

And still, basically nobody goes offroading in touregs or Cayennes.

[Galaxy]

And still, basically nobody goes offroading in touregs or Cayennes.

The vast majority never did. Still, there is a fairly active minority that does group off road events, usually organized via VWVortex, or Touareg Freunde here in Germany.

[Galaxy]

So it's not really the dark ages (not trying to be snarky here).

We are now crawling out of the dark ages. I was talking about the years after Piëch left. Especially Pischetsrieder was a let down. 

[Madman]

I don't always agree with Jack Baruth, but this time he (mostly) nails it!


http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2013/11/avoidable-contact-cayenne-wont-help-ya-cayenne-wont-do-you-no-good/#more-665202

[Rupert]

God that fuck's writing is stupid.

I do more or less agree with what he's saying, though. Two very similar sports cars, three not-sports cars that bank on the sports cars' styling.

[Soup DeVille]

The vast majority never did. Still, there is a fairly active minority that does group off road events, usually organized via VWVortex, or Touareg Freunde here in Germany.

That is some crappy articulation right there. And that's with a swaybar disconnect?

[Rupert]

Those things have height-adjustable suspension, yes?

I don't think I would call that a good off-roader compared to the acual good off-roaders of the world, but it seems like it would be acceptable ability for almost everyone who actually needs that kind of thing.

[Colin]

And the B7 Passat the rest of the world gets (NOT the North American NMS Passat) is really a reworked B6.

Correct but the B8 model, due in 2014 will be all-new, built on the MLB platform that will become as pervasive in larger VW Group cars as the MQB is in the smaller ones. But yes, claiming the B7 was "all new" was somewhat disingenuous.

[12,000 RPM]

God that fuck's writing is stupid.

I do more or less agree with what he's saying, though. Two very similar sports cars, three not-sports cars that bank on the sports cars' styling.

What's wrong with his writing?

[Raza]

What's wrong with his writing?

Have you read it? It's awful. Horrific writing.

[TurboDan]

Whether people offroad them or not, the ability to do so is often one of the claims the guys selling it make. It's not unreasonable to check them on that.

I don't know offhand the difference in ground clearance, but the Touareg can legitimately be taken off-road. Not sure how much Porsche modded it, though...

[Rupert]

What's wrong with his writing?

0_o

Let's start with it being super adversarial for no reason.

[Soup DeVille]

0_o

Let's start with it being super adversarial for no reason.

Do you realize who you're responding to?

[Rupert]

It's a different adversarial style. Baruth says idiotic shit and overgeneralizes just for effect. Not to mention he's a super-snob in all the bad ways.

[12,000 RPM]

Do you realize who you're responding to?

Umad?

[Soup DeVille]

Umad?

About what?

Just pointing out that you're the king of "needlessly adversarial for no good reason."

[12,000 RPM]

About what?

Just pointing out that you're the king of "needlessly adversarial for no good reason."

Im only "adversarial" to people who say stupid shit

[Galaxy]

That is some crappy articulation right there. And that's with a swaybar disconnect?

I don't know, I just grabbed those of google.

[r0tor]

Pretty much all articulation goes out the window with any OEM air ride suspension when its jacked up

[Lebowski]

Im only "adversarial" to people who say stupid shit

Lol.