Car Chat

[cawimmer430]

The symbol is (clearly, to me...) a mechanic's lift. As in, "your car needs to go to a mechanic for inspection and repair of something".

Kind of like a check-engine light, but something that isn't as immediately serious.

Now I feel stupid. 

You're right! It's a "lift" symbol! Silly me.

$900 CAD for front brake pads? That is insanely expensive. I don't know why (or how) you put up with this.

Labor was 150,72 Euros..., car was gone for two hours. That's BMW overpriced labor for ya! 

In all honesty the issues I've had with the car were never really expensive to fix. The ignition coil and injector issues were always handled free-of-charge because it was a known issue.

The most expensive repairs were non-reliability related: damaged transmission oil pan from a stone chip and replacing my front windshield also due to stone chip damage. The transmission oil pan replacement + labor cost around 890,- Euros if I remember correctly, and replacing the front windshield + labor was 1400,- Euros. Thankfully my insurance paid around 75% of the windshield cost.

During the 118i's life the front windshield was replaced three times (!!!) because of cracks caused by stone chips. The first two times I had the windshield replaced at an ATU store which ended up being significantly cheaper (about 700,- Euros + labor). This time however, I was kind of "forced" to get the windshield replaced at BMW because I could only make it to the TÜV on July 30th (the TÜV for the BMW is throughout the month of July), so I figured, Get it done at BMW and get it over with!. Big mistake.

[cawimmer430]

With the issues you've had, you've never seen that light?  Is there another form of check-engine light on the car?  Pretty obvious symbol to me...I mean, you've seen your car on the lift before...

I feel stupid for not being able to identify it.

Sometimes my mind thinks in complex terms, not in simple terms. I definitely know what my check engine light looks like. 

[Soup DeVille]

I feel stupid for not being able to identify it.

Sometimes my mind thinks in complex terms, not in simple terms. I definitely know what my check engine light looks like. 

just like every other one- a V8 with a round top aircleaner and a fixed fan. An engine not made in the past 40 years. At least its more current than the low oil light. If anybody found one of those cans on a beach, they'd try making the genie come out of it.

[cawimmer430]

Kind of a random question, but do most people in Germany get their cars serviced at dealerships? It seems like most people in the states only take their cars to the dealership if it's still under warranty.

I'd say it depends.

If you're leasing a newer car then you're definitely going to take it to a dealership or at least a licensed dealer.

My dad has his 2010 Mercedes E350 CGI serviced at the Benz dealership in Mühldorf. It's a modern and complex car and has a lot of electronics. Not every mechanic here can work on it. He's got the extended warranty, which costs about 800,- Euros a year, but so far he's never needed the original nor the extended warranty.

On the other hand, my dad lets one of his close friends, a former BMW mechanic and mechanical genius, service the 1989 500SL (oil changes, fluid changes etc.). In fact this year the 500SL received a major makeover and was in my dad's friend's makeshift "shop" almost the entire year. The transmission, clutch, roof hydraulics etc. were all disassembled and fine-tuned, repaired etc. Had my dad let the Mercedes' dealer do this the price would have been astronomical. Instead his friend (Hans Hüttinger) orders the parts he needs via telephone (the man does not have Internet nor does he know how to use a computer!) and/or he actually makes simpler parts in his shop. In this small Bavarian town this guy repairs everything from classic motorcycles and cars to the pre-2010 cars AFAIK.

I always had the BMW serviced at genuine BMW dealerships, mostly out of habit and because I figured they'd do a proper job. I don't like taking my car to a mechanic whom I don't trust and who may not know how to work on the car.

[93JC]

Labor was 150,72 Euros..., car was gone for two hours. That's BMW overpriced labor for ya! 

Overpriced labour? If labour was €150.72 it means the parts were over €450. Overpriced BMW parts!! I replaced all of my brake pads and rotors last year, and it was about €200-250.

[Eye of the Tiger]

just like every other one- a V8 with a round top aircleaner and a fixed fan. An engine not made in the past 40 years. At least its more current than the low oil light. If anybody found one of those cans on a beach, they'd try making the genie come out of it.

They should at least upgrade it to an electric fan.

[RomanChariot]

With the issues you've had, you've never seen that light?  Is there another form of check-engine light on the car?  Pretty obvious symbol to me...I mean, you've seen your car on the lift before...

I believe the check engine light is largely for issues that would be picked up by engine sensors that control emissions (O2 sensors, IAC, temperature sensors, etc.). The lift symbol seems to be more of a service required indicator.

[BimmerM3]

Overpriced labour? If labour was €150.72 it means the parts were over €450. Overpriced BMW parts!! I replaced all of my brake pads and rotors last year, and it was about €200-250.

My uncle has an E46 M3 that he took to a track day a few months before his warranty expired just to wear out his brakes so that he could get them replaced under warranty.

[Galaxy]

Are you certain they did not also change the brake discs? They might have done this if the pads are completely shot. The pads themselves for the 1 Series are about ~€30. With labor ~€150.

[shp4man]

BMW's have actual electronic wear sensors on the brakes. The aftermarket didn't have access to the tool to reset them. It was a big stink here in the US. I've heard the batteries in those cars are a pain in the ass to change, too.
Manufacturers do things to make it hard for independent repair shops to perform repairs, both intentionally and unintentionally.
They also make cars easy to build, but generally don't give a shit about ease of service.

[AutobahnSHO]

Kind of a random question, but do most people in Germany get their cars serviced at dealerships? It seems like most people in the states only take their cars to the dealership if it's still under warranty.

Germans are sticklers for doing things "the right way" so even independent shops are generally not as shady as US shops. I don't believe they fear lawsuits from customers, but if they half-assed a job and any crash/ breakdown could be linked to them the garage could face serious trouble.

I don't remember seeing as many independent shops as I see in the US, but then I wasn't looking for garages either. But they are there, so there is a market for non-dealership service.

[CaminoRacer]

I'm taking my car to the dealership on Saturday since most of the independent shops close on the weekends.

Also I'm 99% sure they're gonna have to cut a bolt off so they have a better chance of having a replacement bolt on hand that's the correct size.

[Eye of the Tiger]

BMW's have actual electronic wear sensors on the brakes. The aftermarket didn't have access to the tool to reset them. It was a big stink here in the US. I've heard the batteries in those cars are a pain in the ass to change, too.
Manufacturers do things to make it hard for independent repair shops to perform repairs, both intentionally and unintentionally.
They also make cars easy to build, but generally don't give a shit about ease of service.

I don't get to work on many BMWs, but I get to work on plenty of FCA junk. These used car dealers love to buy thrashed to hell Dodge Darts, Avengers, and Cry-slur 200s. So I get to fix them.

[2o6]

It makes my eyes sear when I seer when I see countless online people call torsion beams "beam axles" or say that a small car doesn't have "IRS".

Torsion beams are independent enough. They're compact and light, people keep saying it's a steal girder with two springs

NO.

It's trailing arms (usually) with a steel girder acting as an axle locator and anti rollbar. It twists and lets a fair amount of suspension interdependence. Not to mention, in a car where space is limited...it works. (Ever looked underneath a Chevy Volt MK1? Where would "IRS" go? The actual torsion beam runs directly under the battery.)

[2o6]

Totally dependent suspension? A solid axle, which is literally a stick with two springs on it. Like an old Minivan.

[Eye of the Tiger]

Transverse mono-leaf? LOLGM.

[cawimmer430]

Overpriced labour? If labour was €150.72 it means the parts were over €450. Overpriced BMW parts!! I replaced all of my brake pads and rotors last year, and it was about €200-250.

Here's the breakdown:

Two Brake Pads:    357,82
Labor:                    150,72
------------------------------
Total:                     508,54 Euros


Now comes the tax...

508,54 Euros + 19% VAT Tax = 96,62 = 605,16 Euros Total



On the one hand it's expensive, on the other hand the brakes on the BMW are really, really, really good. Excellent stopping power, great feedback and for the amount of high speed driving and mileage I've done they tend to last pretty long. In essence one can argue that the parts price is justified.

What just bothers me is that this happened days before the car will be sold. I basically paid for new brake pads for the next owner...

[cawimmer430]

Are you certain they did not also change the brake discs? They might have done this if the pads are completely shot. The pads themselves for the 1 Series are about ~€30. With labor ~€150.

Yes, they also did. Both brake discs = 37,68 Euros on the bill.

[MrH]

Yeah, I could never live in Germany.

[cawimmer430]

Yeah, I could never live in Germany.

Keep in mind that everything (more or less) is more expensive here than in the US.

[MX793]

Yes, they also did. Both brake discs = 37,68 Euros on the bill.

Wait, the PADS were over 350, but the rotors were only ~38 Euro?  That makes no sense.  Pads are cheap.  Rotors are not.

[Soup DeVille]

Wait, the PADS were over 350, but the rotors were only ~38 Euro?  That makes no sense.  Pads are cheap.  Rotors are not.

That's probably just having them turned.

[12,000 RPM]

Keep in mind that everything (more or less) is more expensive here than in the US.

Yea but I'd bet those same brake pads are like $100 here at most. I think you got ripped off, even for Germany. I'd shop around next time

[FoMoJo]

The 2019 Toyota Avalon TRD Proves How Weird Our Reality Has Become

I seem to be at a loss when it comes to modern styling.  Does anyone think this is attractive? 







I do like the wheels...

[shp4man]

The 2019 Toyota Avalon TRD Proves How Weird Our Reality Has Become

I seem to be at a loss when it comes to modern styling.  Does anyone think this is attractive? 







I do like the wheels...

The Japanese seem to be getting away from American design influence and getting back to very Japanese looking vehicles.
They've always liked the "Atomic Cockroach" school of design. Maybe that's too harsh a term. The car is attractive in a Japanese sort of way.

[FoMoJo]

The Japanese seem to be getting away from American design influence and getting back to very Japanese looking vehicles.
They've always liked the "Atomic Cockroach" school of design. Maybe that's too harsh a term. The car is attractive in a Japanese sort of way.

I can relate to Mazda KODO design language with its swoopy lines.  For that matter, I believe that we are all hard-wired to find gracious curves and symmetrical features attractive; which is why so many of us drool over an XK120, but I find that so many design features on modern cars just look tacky.

[Eye of the Tiger]

I'd take a '94-99 Avalon for when I have visitors. The Fiesta is a bit small for three passengers and luggage.

[MX793]

That's probably just having them turned.

I'd be surprised if Germany allowed rotors to be turned.  They're so persnickety about what rims people put on their cars, do you think they'd let someone shave material off of their rotors, making them more prone to warping?

I'm not aware of many places in the US that will turn rotors anymore.  At least not around here.

[shp4man]

All brake rotors have a minimum thickness spec. Machining is Ok unless you go below minimum. Rotors can be damaged by excess heat, though. Those are scrap regardless of thickness.

[2o6]

I'd be surprised if Germany allowed rotors to be turned.  They're so persnickety about what rims people put on their cars, do you think they'd let someone shave material off of their rotors, making them more prone to warping?

I'm not aware of many places in the US that will turn rotors anymore.  At least not around here.

O'reileys does