Brake Pad Time

[Catman]

I now have 41,000 on the ODO and the front pads are 90% gone.  The rotors look very good and even the dealer told me yesterday (ball joint recall) that they wouldn't replace them, maybe just cut them.  I was shocked that I didn't get the sales pitch for new rotors.  Anyway, I'll do the pads myself but do guys think I'll need to touch the rotors?

[280Z Turbo]

You could just bring them into the local auto parts store and get them turned if you want. It shouldn't cost very much at all.

[Catman]

You could just bring them into the local auto parts store and get them turned if you want. It shouldn't cost very much at all.

I was thinking of doing that.  They're really smooth already though and don't pulsate at all.  I'll have to give them a good look once I get the wheels off.

[saxonyron]

Original rotors at 40k miles and no pulsating??  :blink:  Obviously these are pretty good rotors.  As long as they don't pulse, don't touch them.  My original back rotors lasted 110,000 miles.  Just replaced them a few months back.  The front rotors on the A6 are another story.  They end up "warping" within 10 - 15,000 miles every freakin time.    Doesn't matter if I "bed them in" when new, like some people recommend, or just drive regular.  My 10,000 mile old set just started a minor pulsing this week, so judging from past experience it should be unbearable within another 5-10k miles!  

[cozmik]

I'm at about 40k miles and have just recently replaced the front rotors, and will be replacing my rear rotors as soon as they come in. I haven't has any problems with pulsing, the issue is that the pads (all 4 sets that I've had thus far) have just chewed away at the rotors (pretty grooved and a good sized lip). But yeah, I went through 4 sets of pads and never touched the rotors, I see no reason why you should need to if everything is looking and feeling good.  

[footoflead]

I now have 41,000 on the ODO and the front pads are 90% gone.  The rotors look very good and even the dealer told me yesterday (ball joint recall) that they wouldn't replace them, maybe just cut them.  I was shocked that I didn't get the sales pitch for new rotors.  Anyway, I'll do the pads myself but do guys think I'll need to touch the rotors?

if it aint broke dont fix it

if they arent pulsing then dont touch em...slap some new pads in there and you should be good for a while longer... my .02 ....


...the rotors on the 'stang are in pretty decent shape for ~ 60k ... B)  

[VTEC_Inside]

I generally frown on having rotors turned unless they are really bad.

All you end up with is a lighter rotor that will warp easier next time.

[Catman]

When referring to pads is an "axle set" is that both pairs, left and right side?  I believe it is but I want to make sure.

[JYODER240]

40K and your just now going through pads :blink:  I had to replace my front and rears at around 25K in a car that weighs half of a Sequoia. My rotors need turned too, but the lease is up in 4 months so i'll just let it go.

[JWC]

When referring to pads is an "axle set" is that both pairs, left and right side?  I believe it is but I want to make sure.

Should be both sides.

The only thing I suggest would be to deglaze the rotors with a very fine disc. I used my Dremel tool to buff the rotors. If they are not pulsating, I wouldn't have them machined. This is what I did to the Saab last weekend. There is always a small (sometimes large) amount of pad transfer. It is a rule at our shop to machine them even if it is a very light cut, just to renew the surface for the new pads to bite better.

[Catman]

When referring to pads is an "axle set" is that both pairs, left and right side?  I believe it is but I want to make sure.

Should be both sides.

The only thing I suggest would be to deglaze the rotors with a very fine disc. I used my Dremel tool to buff the rotors. If they are not pulsating, I wouldn't have them machined. This is what I did to the Saab last weekend. There is always a small (sometimes large) amount of pad transfer. It is a rule at our shop to machine them even if it is a very light cut, just to renew the surface for the new pads to bite better.

So, should I get a light machining done?

[JWC]

When referring to pads is an "axle set" is that both pairs, left and right side?  I believe it is but I want to make sure.

Should be both sides.

The only thing I suggest would be to deglaze the rotors with a very fine disc. I used my Dremel tool to buff the rotors. If they are not pulsating, I wouldn't have them machined. This is what I did to the Saab last weekend. There is always a small (sometimes large) amount of pad transfer. It is a rule at our shop to machine them even if it is a very light cut, just to renew the surface for the new pads to bite better.

So, should I get a light machining done?

If the rotors are smooth without any grooves, I'd just buff them off. Whatever the surface of the rotor looks like, your new pads will eventually wear to match. Keep in mind, that those grooves represent an area the pads are not contacting, decreasing the surface contact area and consequently decreasing your stopping power.  

One of the main reasons we insist on a light cut is due to brake noise, which is common on either the pad or the rotor not being smooth, and generated most of our comeback complaints after a brake service.

[Catman]

When referring to pads is an "axle set" is that both pairs, left and right side?? I believe it is but I want to make sure.

Should be both sides.

The only thing I suggest would be to deglaze the rotors with a very fine disc. I used my Dremel tool to buff the rotors. If they are not pulsating, I wouldn't have them machined. This is what I did to the Saab last weekend. There is always a small (sometimes large) amount of pad transfer. It is a rule at our shop to machine them even if it is a very light cut, just to renew the surface for the new pads to bite better.

So, should I get a light machining done?

If the rotors are smooth without any grooves, I'd just buff them off. Whatever the surface of the rotor looks like, your new pads will eventually wear to match. Keep in mind, that those grooves represent an area the pads are not contacting, decreasing the surface contact area and consequently decreasing your stopping power.  

One of the main reasons we insist on a light cut is due to brake noise, which is common on either the pad or the rotor not being smooth, and generated most of our comeback complaints after a brake service.

I took a decent look today and they are grooved.  Not excessively so but as much as you'd expect for 40K on them.  

[JWC]

When referring to pads is an "axle set" is that both pairs, left and right side?  I believe it is but I want to make sure.

Should be both sides.

The only thing I suggest would be to deglaze the rotors with a very fine disc. I used my Dremel tool to buff the rotors. If they are not pulsating, I wouldn't have them machined. This is what I did to the Saab last weekend. There is always a small (sometimes large) amount of pad transfer. It is a rule at our shop to machine them even if it is a very light cut, just to renew the surface for the new pads to bite better.

So, should I get a light machining done?

If the rotors are smooth without any grooves, I'd just buff them off. Whatever the surface of the rotor looks like, your new pads will eventually wear to match. Keep in mind, that those grooves represent an area the pads are not contacting, decreasing the surface contact area and consequently decreasing your stopping power.  

One of the main reasons we insist on a light cut is due to brake noise, which is common on either the pad or the rotor not being smooth, and generated most of our comeback complaints after a brake service.

I took a decent look today and they are grooved.  Not excessively so but as much as you'd expect for 40K on them.

You can get the specs for minimum thickness from the dealer (maybe even online somewhere) then take a measurement to see how much is going to be machined down to smooth out the rotor surface. This will tell you how thin they will be. The closer to minimum thickness, the more likely the rotors will warp with heavy usage, i.e., towing a boat or camper and driving in a lot of stop n'go city traffic.

[Catman]

Wondering why I should bother when I can get a set of Brembo OEM rotors for about $110.  I have to take it apart anyway and if I cut the stock ones and then they prove troublesome then I'll have to put a another day aside to do it again.  Maybe I'll just get new rotors too and be done with it.  The extra $100 will get me longer brake life and eliminate the possibility of any issues.

[saxonyron]

I 2nd that thought - my mechanic says the same thing.  It'll cost around $100 to turn them and end up with thinner weaker rotors which will fail sooner.  He says almost no one turns rotors any more. Even rotors for the A6 only cost $120 a pair. Of course mine only last about 20 minutes.        

[JWC]

I 2nd that thought - my mechanic says the same thing.  It'll cost around $100 to turn them and end up with thinner weaker rotors which will fail sooner.  He says almost no one turns rotors any more. Even rotors for the A6 only cost $120 a pair. Of course mine only last about 20 minutes.      

Depends on whether you are trying to save some cash or not.

As I mention in another thread, the V70 I'm picking up needs brakes. Though I could have had it serviced for free at my shop, they will machine the rotors, I elected to do it myself. I'll be replacing all four rotors and both pad sets.

Watch what mechanics say. Labor for replacing pads and machining rotors usually runs anywhere from 55.00 to 90.00. The trick is, they will charge the same whether they replace the rotors or machine them... but they can move the vehicle in and out of the shop quicker by replacing the rotors instead of having to machine them....increasing profits by increasing productivity.  It is to their advantage to get you to let them sell you rotors, takes less time and they gain the mark-up on the rotors.

[Catman]

I 2nd that thought - my mechanic says the same thing.  It'll cost around $100 to turn them and end up with thinner weaker rotors which will fail sooner.  He says almost no one turns rotors any more. Even rotors for the A6 only cost $120 a pair. Of course mine only last about 20 minutes.     

Depends on whether you are trying to save some cash or not.

As I mention in another thread, the V70 I'm picking up needs brakes. Though I could have had it serviced for free at my shop, they will machine the rotors, I elected to do it myself. I'll be replacing all four rotors and both pad sets.

Watch what mechanics say. Labor for replacing pads and machining rotors usually runs anywhere from 55.00 to 90.00. The trick is, they will charge the same whether they replace the rotors or machine them... but they can move the vehicle in and out of the shop quicker by replacing the rotors instead of having to machine them....increasing profits by increasing productivity.  It is to their advantage to get you to let them sell you rotors, takes less time and they gain the mark-up on the rotors.

Which is why I was surprised the dealer told me that they looked good and that they'd machine them.  

As long as I'm taking everything apart I think I'll throw on some new ones.    Any suggestions on web retailers?

[Catman]

I can get OEM quality Brembo rotors and EBC organic/low dust pads for $180.  Not as bad as I thought.

[hounddog]

This is just my opinion, and I'm no mechanic, but I know from my pursuit instructor training that when you just put new rotors on you create 'high spots' left from the grooves etched in by the previous pads- that will super heat compared to the rest of the rotor.  I undertand that this will cause the rotor to warp faster, and the pads to wear unevenly and prematurly.  

We were told that you should either have them turned or put new one on.  With the alloys currently used, so we were told, you can actually change (I might be wrong on which one here) either the chemical makeup or the chemical structure of the alloy by doing a 'turning'.  I don't remember what they said exactly.  

Just leave em be- when they stop working- stop using the pedal.  It's kind of a Zen thing- if they won't work-f*k em!  

[footoflead]

This is just my opinion, and I'm no mechanic, but I know from my pursuit instructor training that when you just put new rotors on you create 'high spots' left from the grooves etched in by the previous pads- that will super heat compared to the rest of the rotor.  I undertand that this will cause the rotor to warp faster, and the pads to wear unevenly and prematurly.  

We were told that you should either have them turned or put new one on.  With the alloys currently used, so we were told, you can actually change (I might be wrong on which one here) either the chemical makeup or the chemical structure of the alloy by doing a 'turning'.  I don't remember what they said exactly.  

Just leave em be- when they stop working- stop using the pedal.  It's kind of a Zen thing- if they won't work-f*k em!  

:blink:    

[sparkplug]

Turn the rotors a small amount. It shouldn't need to be turned much so as not to take too much material off the rotor. Put on new pads.

The new pads will need to be broke in carefully.

I've been the main driver of my dad's 96 Explorer. It has over 130,000 miles. But I don't remember ever having to put new pads on it. Of course the roads where is live are downhill and stops signs are all uphill.:D  :D  :D  :D  :P  :P

[VTEC_Inside]

I just recentley put new front pads on my Accord. I would have usually just replaced the rotors as well since they are pretty cheap, but I couldn't have been bothered this time.

The rotors on the car have never been machined and were not groved or pitted.

All I did once I put the new ones on was go through the short run of breaking in new brakes. I did a few firm progressive stops from higher and higher speeds up to about 120kph slowing to a slow roll and back up to speed. At one point they started to make ungodly amounts of noise, but a few more stops and they are fine.

The biggest deal for me was that both cailpers were dry as a desert. The passenger side outer pad was just about gone as the caliper had hung up a bit. I greased the ever loving piss out of the slides and retaining tabs and its good as new again. I was actually pleasantly suprised at how much better it stops now. The gradual braking loss common with this type of thing makes it hard to know how bad things have gotten until you fix it.

[hounddog]

This is just my opinion, and I'm no mechanic, but I know from my pursuit instructor training that when you just put new rotors on you create 'high spots' left from the grooves etched in by the previous pads- that will super heat compared to the rest of the rotor.  I undertand that this will cause the rotor to warp faster, and the pads to wear unevenly and prematurly. 

We were told that you should either have them turned or put new one on.  With the alloys currently used, so we were told, you can actually change (I might be wrong on which one here) either the chemical makeup or the chemical structure of the alloy by doing a 'turning'.  I don't remember what they said exactly. 

Just leave em be- when they stop working- stop using the pedal.  It's kind of a Zen thing- if they won't work-f*k em!   

:blink:  

Although it wasn't written in perfect grammar, what's the problem?  If you are talking about the last line- that was a joke.  Maybe not a good one, but it was a joke none the less.

[hounddog]

I just recentley put new front pads on my Accord. I would have usually just replaced the rotors as well since they are pretty cheap, but I couldn't have been bothered this time.

The rotors on the car have never been machined and were not groved or pitted.

All I did once I put the new ones on was go through the short run of breaking in new brakes. I did a few firm progressive stops from higher and higher speeds up to about 120kph slowing to a slow roll and back up to speed. At one point they started to make ungodly amounts of noise, but a few more stops and they are fine.

The biggest deal for me was that both cailpers were dry as a desert. The passenger side outer pad was just about gone as the caliper had hung up a bit. I greased the ever loving piss out of the slides and retaining tabs and its good as new again. I was actually pleasantly suprised at how much better it stops now. The gradual braking loss common with this type of thing makes it hard to know how bad things have gotten until you fix it.

You kinda did what we do with our squad cars with new brakes.  We put on new rotors and pads, and replace any of the clips/springs or any other parts that are worn/bent/loose/or weak.  Once they are on and back at the department, we take the car out and do four 60-0 pedal fully depressed stops.  Then we do a 90-0 fully depressed stop.

This is called burnishing the brakes.  The point of us doing this is that the material used to bond the components of the brake pad is a high tech glue.   When under severe duty the brakes heat up causing the glue to turn into a gas and then form a gas barrier between the pad and the rotor.  This is what most of us call "brake fade" and also causes the cloud of smoke you see when you use your brakes very hard for several stops in a row.   Once you burn off the glue you shouldn't have brake fade until the brakes need to be replaced.  So hopefully when we chase someone we won't have to worry about brake fade or not having brakes at a pivital moment! Which is why on TV you see bad guys running into things and the cop cars stop short- uh, sometimes.   Plus it's a lot of fun to have the chief tell you to go out and beat a car for a few minutes!

[Catman]

Interesting Hounddog. :ph34r:  

[hounddog]

Interesting Hounddog. :ph34r:

Actually, looking at my post i have it backwards
90-0 first  and then the four 60-0's.  The other way around will warp the rotors.  Keep in mind if you do this, it will make the brakes lose that new-put you in the windshield feeling.

[Catman]

Ordered the Brembo rotors and a set of EBC pads.  

[VTEC_Inside]

Ordered the Brembo rotors and a set of EBC pads.

Remember to paint your calipers bright red too...

:P  

[Catman]

Ordered the Brembo rotors and a set of EBC pads.

Remember to paint your calipers bright red too...

:P

Nah. :P