The troubleshooting game.

[VTEC_Inside]

I had an idea that could provide some entertainment in here and educate at the same time.

I know that most of us aren't full blown mechanics, but we've certaintly got our share of mechanically inclined folks.

Not that it has to be a regular thing, but I think it would be fun if people posted up automotive problems and had the rest of us try and diagnose. ie you provide the symptoms and answer questions, while we try to solve the problem.

Of course knowing the answer would help the game out a bit, but I suppose if we could actually help to solve a problem that would be great too.

I don't know how well this will work, but I'll give it a shot by starting us off with an easy one (well I guess thats a relative term).


Vehicle: 1994 Buick Regal, 3.8L
Problem: Little to no heat from the climate control
Observations: Engine temperature appears to be alright, maybe a little low. Upper rad hose is hot, and cooling fans appear to be operating as they should.

[heelntoe]

water pump?

edit: didnt read the problem.

[VTEC_Inside]

water pump?

Engine not overheating, coolant confirmed to be circulating.

[The Pirate]

Heater core bad?

[VTEC_Inside]

Heater core bad?

We have a winner.

Figured it wouldn't take too long. Heater core was clogged up. Its been replaced and now there is an inferno comming out of the vents.

[MX793]

Heater core bad?

That would one be guess.  Could also be a problem with the thermostat or the little door/valve that controls the mixture of air in the HVAC system.

[VTEC_Inside]

That would one be guess.  Could also be a problem with the thermostat or the little door/valve that controls the mixture of air in the HVAC system.

I did replace the thermostat since its easy and cheap on this engine. I also speculated that the mixture door could be the problem, but ruled it out as moving the temperature from cold to hot did yield a difference, but not much of one.

Ok, so whos got the next one?

[AutobahnSHO]

Umm, my 1992 van sounds funny?     
Engine noise at idle.

I replaced the serpentine belt (it and the tensioner broke last winter,) and this summer did the waterpump as preventative maintenance. 

I'll try to post the sound today..

[VTEC_Inside]

Umm, my 1992 van sounds funny?     
Engine noise at idle.

I replaced the serpentine belt (it and the tensioner broke last winter,) and this summer did the waterpump as preventative maintenance. 

I'll try to post the sound today..

I think its the nut behind the wheel.

[93JC]

Umm, my 1992 van sounds funny?? ? ?
Engine noise at idle.

I replaced the serpentine belt (it and the tensioner broke last winter,) and this summer did the waterpump as preventative maintenance.?

I'll try to post the sound today..

What engine does it have?

[S204STi]

Put a stethoscope on the alternator.

Could be worn bushes.

Great thread idea BTW VTEC_inside!

[VTEC_Inside]

What engine does it have?

On that note we should lay some ground rules.

When starting a new "problem", please state the following:
- Vehicle - make, model, year, engine, and transmission(if it isn't a given)
- Problem/Symptoms - what caused you to start poking around.
- Observations - what you have discovered thus far, and any other preliminary information that may be relevant.

[AutobahnSHO]

What engine does it have?

Good point.

It's a 1992 3.3L Plymouth Voyager (chrysler/dodge), FWD  4spd auto tranny,
The sound has steadily grown worse over the last year or so, and come to think of it, I'm probably causing the alternator to work a little bit more since I put the sound system in.  Wonder what kind of power it draws?? (Too lazy and it's raining now to check it out.)  And now that I think about it, I need to replace the alternator bracket on top: it's broken but the small corner that the top bolt goes through has held it in place..

And it also sounds crappy on startup: I assume it needs some real engine work but i don't know if I'll get to it before I leave for Kuwait in May.

R-Inge, I'll definitely take a listen.
I really don't know how much we can all figure out from through this magical internet tube-thingey, I was sorta kidding, but I'll check it out.

(A few years back the SHO forum guys diagnosed a bad crank sensor for me from a lame problem description, but those are well-known problems...)

[AutobahnSHO]

PS-
I don't know the history on the alternator, I bought the van at 82k miles in May 2004.  Now it's got 116k.
The battery was brand-new, stolen from the SHO when I scrapped it, and it's bigger/more amps than the original..

[GoCougs]

We have a winner.

Figured it wouldn't take too long. Heater core was clogged up. Its been replaced and now there is an inferno comming out of the vents.

I had that clogged problem once, except that it was of a frozen water variety clog. Yep, not enough antifreeze...

[GoCougs]

1982 Dodge Ramcharger. 318 V8. AT. 180,000 mile. Very cold day.

Similar problem: no heat from HVAC system. Engine temperature normal (per gage, and heat felt from engine when hood was up).

Note: not the clog issue I just mentioned.

[S204STi]

(Concerning Will's dilema)

The major rotating assemblies on the front of your engine are the alternator, water pump, a/c compressor, and the idler and/or tensioner pulleys.? You already have a new tensioner and water pump, are there any other idler pulleys on these?? That leaves the A/C compressor and the alternator.

If the alternator and the a/c comp run on seperate belts try removing one or the other, whichever is convienient, and run the engine for a few minutes to listen.? If one eliminates the noise, ding-ding!!

[S204STi]

1982 Dodge Ramcharger. 318 V8. AT. 180,000 mile. Very cold day.

Similar problem: no heat from HVAC system. Engine temperature normal (per gage, and heat felt from engine when hood was up).

Note: not the clog issue I just mentioned.

Air-bound heater core from coolant leak?

[Eye of the Tiger]

Umm, my 1992 van sounds funny?? ? ?
Engine noise at idle.

I replaced the serpentine belt (it and the tensioner broke last winter,) and this summer did the waterpump as preventative maintenance.?

I'll try to post the sound today..

Can you describe the noise a bit more, and how it relateds to engine rpm.

[AutobahnSHO]

Can you describe the noise a bit more, and how it relateds to engine rpm.

I'll get something on it tomorrow- but it's just noisy at idle, sounds mechanical (valvetrain?) and I haven't really paid attention with revving it.
It's only got 1 accessory belt, which is more trouble to get on/off than I want to deal with just to see if it's the accessories. 

I'll tinker with it in the next few months-

[GoCougs]

Air-bound heater core from coolant leak?

Not exactly, but you're close.

Hint: though the engine was hot per the gage and to the touch, the upper radiator hose was cool. Nothing was frozen or clogged, either.

[AutobahnSHO]

Not exactly, but you're close.

Hint: though the engine was hot per the gage and to the touch, the upper radiator hose was cool. Nothing was frozen or clogged, either.

Busted thermostat.  It wasn't opening?

[AutobahnSHO]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WUeYqQdLOw
So here's the easiest way to record sound for you guys.

The startup didn't record as well as I'd hoped, and the batteries died as I was recording with the hood closed- but it's NOISY.

Notice too the broken alternator mount (where the bolt goes in isn't connected to the rest of the bracket) and there's a clicking coming from the top of the block (didn't capture well)- is that the injectors or valvetrain?

And so you know, the alternator is on top back (relative to the car) of the engine, a/c compressor top front, a few pulleys, the power steering is low, the waterpump is bottom front.

[S204STi]

Not exactly, but you're close.

Hint: though the engine was hot per the gage and to the touch, the upper radiator hose was cool. Nothing was frozen or clogged, either.

Did the vehicle ever overheat?

[S204STi]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WUeYqQdLOw
So here's the easiest way to record sound for you guys.

The startup didn't record as well as I'd hoped, and the batteries died as I was recording with the hood closed- but it's NOISY.

Notice too the broken alternator mount (where the bolt goes in isn't connected to the rest of the bracket) and there's a clicking coming from the top of the block (didn't capture well)- is that the injectors or valvetrain?

And so you know, the alternator is on top back (relative to the car) of the engine, a/c compressor top front, a few pulleys, the power steering is low, the waterpump is bottom front.

While it's running pour some water on the belt slowly.? Does the pitch of the noise change or go away completely?? If so it's your belt.

That clicking I heard when you were over the block sounds normal.  The valvetrain creates a lot of noise normally.

[GoCougs]

Did the vehicle ever overheat?

In the true classical sense (as in a boil-over), no, it did not.

Hint: Once remedied (which was a quick, cheap and easy fix), their didn't appear to be any damage.

Another hint: the conditions of the day were critical.

[S204STi]

In the true classical sense (as in a boil-over), no, it did not.

Hint: Once remedied (which was a quick, cheap and easy fix), their didn't appear to be any damage.

Another hint: the conditions of the day were critical.

Are we talking 105F or below freezing?

And did the temp gauge soar is what I was meaning to ask.

[GoCougs]

Are we talking 105F or below freezing?

And did the temp gauge soar is what I was meaning to ask.

It was very cold, like 5F, blowing wind, and highway travel.

The temperature gage was normal.

[S204STi]

It was very cold, like 5F, blowing wind, and highway travel.

The temperature gage was normal.

Did you blow a hose?

[GoCougs]

Did you blow a hose?

Perhaps I cheated a bit. There wasn't actually anything broken per se. I actually I ran it almost competely empty of coolant.

I was on a long drive to from Seattle up to British Columbia. After about 80 miles, I started getting cold. I just figured that with the low temperature, howling wind, and the relative large size of the interior, the HVAC system just couldn't keep up. But upon feeling the air out of the vents, it was cold. I knew that that wasn't right.

So I pull off the freeway and stop at a Schuck's type place. I pop the hood to take a look, but don't see anything obvious. I did see some evidence of leaking coolant from around the thermostat housing, but I'd always had that since seems to be common place for erosion for aftermarket aluminum intake manifolds.

Anyway, I went in the store to ask advice, and they really didn't have any clue either. Being some kind of cooling system issue, we popped the radiator cap just as a general investigative measure, and didn't see any coolant. In fact, it was completely dry. Didn't think much of it, but knew that while I was there, I should get some water and antifreeze. So I buy 1 gallon bottles of each. I add a bit of each, but I didn't see the coolant level rise (still saw no coolant). So then I add more and more, until I added 2 gallons total. Still no sign of coolant level from looking down the radiator fill neck. I buy more. And more.

All told, I figured that with what I had to add to get it filled, I'd run it about 90% dry. The thermostat housing must of leaked far more than I had figured. After that, I started it up, and had plenty of heat in short order. IMO, I didn't suffer catastrophic damage due to the cold weather and howling wind. I didn't have those inner fender splash guards, so wind was entering the engine compartment with ease. I'm sure the engine (and especially the water pump) took somewhat of a beating, but I never had any problems with it after that.

As far as the temperature gage, I'm not sure why it didn't measure anything out of the ordinary; or IIRC, I didn't remember it doing so. It was a stock gage with non-dimensioned hash marks, so its accuracy I'm sure wasn't the best.