Lexus LC500

[12,000 RPM]

http://jalopnik.com/the-100-000-lexus-lc-500-is-the-most-badass-lexus-sinc-1752278150

New RWD platform, uses the 5.0 V8 out of the RC F, new 10 speed automatic (will need it to stay in powerband)

Mixed feels but I want to hear what other people think first.

[SVT666]

Looks sweet. Aside from the taillight treatment that is. However, I fail to understand what is sporting about a 10 speed auto.

[GoCougs]

Looks good both in and out but $100k is a ton for a car that doesn't have any more motor than a $40k Camaro SS or $60k Corvette.

I dunno - Lexus is definitely on a mission sticking with these N/A -F cars. Could be they're going after driving experience rather than all-out performance? I mean, an M5 or E63 is a hoot to drive I'm sure, but you gotta suffer with turbos and in many cases mandatory AWD to put all that power down, whereas the GS-F is still pretty damned fast for public roads, and will sound glorious and have stellar throttle response.

[68_427]

Is that the production body?

[RomanChariot]

What is with the flying buttress going into the dash?

[68_427]

Just looked and fck yessss

[12,000 RPM]

Ooof. Yea, Nakamichi tape deck interior aside, I'm seeing this thing having problems getting away from a Stingray. Can't really hang a hat on the "driving experience" claim with a 10 speed auto. Is it weird to say this is what the RC should have been?

Seeing a bit of Alpine/Renault GTA 610 and maybe some SVX in the rear 3/4. I'm torn on this one.

[SJ_GTI]

Looks good IMHO. Seems like a legit 911 competitor. not something I would buy but I can see some rich folks buying this over an equivalent german car.

I don't think the power is that big of an issue. I mean...its auto only (and slushbox auto at that), I don't think all out performance is the goal.

[MX793]

Looks good IMHO. Seems like a legit 911 competitor. not something I would buy but I can see some rich folks buying this over an equivalent german car.

I don't think the power is that big of an issue. I mean...its auto only (and slushbox auto at that), I don't think all out performance is the goal.

It'll only be a 911 competitor if they can keep the weight.  Somehow, Lexus made the RC significantly heavier than the IS.  IIRC, the RCF is 2 tons.

[SJ_GTI]

It'll only be a 911 competitor if they can keep the weight.  Somehow, Lexus made the RC significantly heavier than the IS.  IIRC, the RCF is 2 tons.

I guess that's true. For some reason I always think of the 911 as more of a GT car, event though you are right it is pretty light for its size (relative to other new cars, anyway).

[2o6]

Do you know how many 6 series I've driven? That's what this car is aimed at, not the corvette or anything like it. If you're comparing it on sheer stats alone, you're missing the point.

[CALL_911]

Do you know how many 6 series I've driven? That's what this car is aimed at, not the corvette or anything like it. If you're comparing it on sheer stats alone, you're missing the point.

Agreed. I really like this thing.

[GoCougs]

The new age of slushies (see ZF and GM 8 sp) is upon us whereas their performance engagement comes close to a DSG and there is little if any performance or engagement lost to a traditional M/T/. Also, just in general, very few people want a M/T these days, esp. in a Lexus or this class of car.

[CALL_911]

Looks good IMHO. Seems like a legit 911 competitor. not something I would buy but I can see some rich folks buying this over an equivalent german car.

I don't think the power is that big of an issue. I mean...its auto only (and slushbox auto at that), I don't think all out performance is the goal.

Er...it's not really supposed to be a 911 competitor. This is shooting at the S-coupe/6-series segment.

I'm sort of curious as to why they decided to introduce this new platform with this rather than a new LS. The LS has definitely been outgunned to the point where it's no longer relevant, a real shame considering it was a class leader.

[CALL_911]

It'll only be a 911 competitor if they can keep the weight.  Somehow, Lexus made the RC significantly heavier than the IS.  IIRC, the RCF is 2 tons.

IIRC, RC is more a GS coupe than it is an IS coupe

[SJ_GTI]

The new age of slushies (see ZF and GM 8 sp) is upon us whereas their performance engagement comes close to a DSG and there is little if any performance or engagement lost to a traditional M/T/. Also, just in general, very few people want a M/T these days, esp. in a Lexus or this class of car.

I drove an A4 with the ZF 8-speed. It felt like a normal automatic. Have driven plenty of DSG VW/Audi's and they are not the same. Other than missing a third pedal DSG feels just like a manual (because it is, for the most part). The 8-speed auto does not.

Granted, I'm sure most people prefer the ZF. That slight disconnect between engine RPM and acceleration/deceleration is part of what makes them so smooth, but you lose some connection to the machine itself (IMHO). I would take a 6-speed DSG/DCT over an 8/9/10 speed automatic any day.

All that being said, I don't think the auto in this car is a drawback. I don't think this car is built to maximize driver engagement. Its meant to be fun to drive (which I am sure it is), fast, good looking, and reasonably comfortable.

[12,000 RPM]

If it is going against the 6 then the engine is out of place. Def needs turbos

[SVT666]

If it is going against the 6 then the engine is out of place. Def needs turbos

WTF?

[MX793]

The new age of slushies (see ZF and GM 8 sp) is upon us whereas their performance engagement comes close to a DSG and there is little if any performance or engagement lost to a traditional M/T/. Also, just in general, very few people want a M/T these days, esp. in a Lexus or this class of car.

DSGs aren't any more engaging than automatics.  They just shift quicker.

[SJ_GTI]

DSGs aren't any more engaging than automatics.  They just shift quicker.

Not sure what you mean. You have a Jetta so I am assuming you have driven both (auto and DSG).

With DSG's the RPM's don't  drop up an down unless the car is accelerating or decelerating (or shifting). The ZF 8-speed works just like a normal automatic.

I am not an engineer but they feel different. Driving a manual in 1st gear without shifting feels different then driving an automatic in 1st gear without shifting. The automatic will accelerate/decelerate smoother, but is less immediate. Once its in gear DSG feels like a manual.

[SVT666]

DSGs aren't any more engaging than automatics.  They just shift quicker.

Wrong.  A DSG feels much better than an auto.

[CALL_911]

Wrong.  A DSG feels much better than an auto.

Have you driven anything with the ZF 8AT?

Also, just because it feels better when it shifts doesn't make it any more engaging. The steps required to operate (engage) a DSG are identical to those required to operate (engage) a slushbox.

[GoCougs]

In a slushy AT there is no mechanical coupling between engine and tranny - it's a fluid (soft) coupling via the torque converter. This means there is going to be some slip (tranny RPM will slightly lag engine RPM) and absorption of drive train feedback (note: at times there the torque converter will lock such as cruising on the freeway but by and large it's not locked at low RPM, WOT and when shifting).

In a DSG there is direct mechanical coupling between engine and transmission - it's a hard coupling courtesy of wet clutches. There is no slip or absorption of drive train feedback.

The differences are noticeable and why IMO a DSG is definitely more engaging than a traditional slushy AT - it doesn't slip nor absorb drive train feedback. The new breed of slushie ATs perform very well what with quick upshifts and quick rev-matching down shifts, but at the end of the day it's still a "slushy" fluid coupling.

[Submariner]

It's going to age terribly, just like the Lexus's entire current lineup.

[CALL_911]

I disagree. Yeah, some of the details are a tad overwrought, but the silhouette is classic.

[Cookie Monster]

I disagree. Yeah, some of the details are a tad overwrought, but the silhouette is classic.

Some? Pretty much every styling detail on that car has been taken to an extreme.

[MX793]

Wrong.  A DSG feels much better than an auto.

From a "driver engagement" standpoint, a DSG is just a very crisp automatic with paddle shifters.  It does not engage the driver any more than an automatic.  Put it in D and it will shift automatically.  Flip a paddle/button and it will change up or down a gear.  Driver involvement is the same.  The DSG is better than a torque converter auto, but it doesn't engage the driver any more than a traditional slushy.  They certainly don't offer the same level of driver engagement as a traditional MT.  DSG is a nice alternative to a traditional slushy, IMO.

[12,000 RPM]

WTF?

Someone buying a luxocoupe is not looking to rev to 8K to merge onto the highway. The demands of the engine from the user are at odds with the intended purpose of the car.

[CALL_911]

From a "driver engagement" standpoint, a DSG is just a very crisp automatic with paddle shifters.  It does not engage the driver any more than an automatic.  Put it in D and it will shift automatically.  Flip a paddle/button and it will change up or down a gear.  Driver involvement is the same.  The DSG is better than a torque converter auto, but it doesn't engage the driver any more than a traditional slushy.  They certainly don't offer the same level of driver engagement as a traditional MT.  DSG is a nice alternative to a traditional slushy, IMO.

This is exactly what I mean

[SVT666]

Someone buying a luxocoupe is not looking to rev to 8K to merge onto the highway. The demands of the engine from the user are at odds with the intended purpose of the car.

So it should have turbos?